The WSox/Indians play the last three. If they go into the series 2 up, one win clinches 1st. If they do this the 1st game, they will rest their players and field a team that would make Womack look like a star.
They will borrow 2 starting pitchers from our Pen. It will assure the Indians 2 easy wins to close the year, one of which may be the 1 game they beat us by for the WC.

"Ricciardi loves David Ortiz, even compared him to Barry Bonds in terms of the fear factor that comes when Ortiz approaches the batter's box....

But, Ricciardi says he likes Alex Rodriguez as the MVP. ``I love David Ortiz, don't get me wrong. How can you not love what he's done? But Alex can beat you with his glove,'' he said.

Should Ortiz not win the MVP, a common lament will be that he is a designated hitter, but Ricciardi makes the distinction between wearing a glove and knowing what to do with it.

'If Alex was a butcher in left field, there would be no difference, but he isn't just a good fielder, he can win games with his defense. He did it to us. You don't know how big that is.'

I'm already hedging my bets with myself by saying that we can afford to drop one but not two of the games in Camden. Going into Boston a game back would only mean that we need to win the series to get a playoff in Yankee Stadium. Losing both games and falling two back would require a sweep.

I think I'm actually more optimistic than that, but I'll stick with the idea that Boston will win out against Toronto, and that we'll need to do the same. I can't see us dropping two and therefore our scenario remains the same. Worst case scenario is that we need two in Boston to either tie and force the playoff or win the whole enchilada outright.

I can easily see Boston losing one against the Jays though. Toronto is a .500 club and plays like it, but that means that they win 1 out of every two and that's what remains with Beantown. Two games. Win one for the Clipper.

How I would love a one game cushion. Mr. Chacon and Mr. Small.....we're behind you and if the clock should strike twelve, it's just the alarm to let you know all's well.....no pumpkin in sight.

You make a good point, but wouldn't the White Sox want to try to bury the Indians if they have the chance? As it stands, I'm not sure they would be smart to play soft when they could eliminate the Indians from Playoff contention. The Indians may be cooling off, but they have felt a lot like the team to beat for the past few weeks.

Bury the team at hand.

And probably next Yankee manager Piniella is on record that Ortiz is the MVP.

The MVP will likely be decided by what happens on the field over the next five days. As for yesterday, Ortiz delivered in game one, knocking in two runs in a 3-1 win. When he came up in the ninth of the second, they were two runs down and the bases were empty. Had the Jays not scored in the top of the ninth, he likely would have tied the game with a 420 foot bomb.

On the other side, A-Rod, while it was still a game, struck out twice, once looking, both times with two runners on. He hit a very impressive, but useless, rbi double after the horse had left the barn.

The MVP will come from the team that wins the division.

Likely? So if he swung for the fences down one run, Ortiz would have 'likely' homered? If it's likely then, then why not hit a homer when down two runs? The guy behind you still needs to score as well, anyway.

Your twisted logic is a bit of a joke.

Yesterday, he came up twice with RISP and couldn't deliver. That pisses me off. He had the chance to put the nail in the coffin and really hurt the O's pyschologically with his bat. A team like the O's starts to pack it in if they down by 4 or more runs. They don't think about coming back, let alone scoring 17 runs. I'm not saying that Leiter, Felix, Proctor, etc, would have come in and shut them down but they would've had a better cusion and probably changing their philosophy on how they pitch to the batter in the box.

Of course, the same can be said for the Sox. Personally, I'm not ready for the playoffs to essentially begin on Friday, but looks like we don't have a choice...

Unfortunately, Mussina had one of those bombs last night that exposed our woefully inadequate bullpen. It's scary when our starter is worse than the middle relief. At least Mo and Flash got a rest, but that's about all I can come up with as a positive.

Regarding A-Rod, it would not have mattered much if he had knocked in a few runs rather than striking out, because we lost by quite a bit more than a few runs.

To Debris though, it is a given that A-Rod would have homered at every at bat last night if Mussina was on and the game was closer, but he could see that it would not matter so he didn't bother!

First off, while Fenway is a good place for left handed hitters, it has not been a hitters park since they put up the 600 Club some 20 years ago.

As for giving the award to players with no fielding value, how do you feel about giving the award to players who spend 130 games sitting on the bench, such as Clemens in '86, Gibson in '68, Koufax in '63, Blue in '71? Or to players who appear in 80 innings per season, such as Hernandez in '84, Eckersely in '92, Fingers in '81? Or to players who had less than no fielding value, due to their inability to play their position, such as Killebrew in '69, Powell in 70, Jackson in '73?

Would Ortiz be more valuable if he'd played a mediocre first base all season? If you look over the list of MVPs, you'll find that, while some were great fielders, they all won it for what they did with their bat. How many MVP awards do you see for Ozzie Smith or Bill Mazeroski?

Right or wrong, and I'm on the side of those who agree it's wrong, defensive accomplishments are rarely, if ever, taken into consideration when ballots are cast.

Manny had 165 rbis in 1999 and Ivan Rodriguez won the MVP.

Cecil Fielder led the league in RBIs three years in a row and hit 50 hrs when nobody else was hitting 50 hrs. He lost MVPs to Cal Ripken and Rickey Henderson. It would seem that defense and even baerunning (!) can add value to the team and are taken into account by the voters.

The voters are not always consistent, that's for certain. But defensive accomplishments are always taken into account. If they're not taken into account, then a baseball fan such as yourself should decry that fact.

Ortiz may be the MVP. But if you think that RBI Leader = MVP, then you're simply factually incorrect.

Yes, Ortiz would be more valuable if he palyed a mediocre first base. That fact is too obvious to even debate. If he could play a mediocre first base, perhaps the Red Sox could cut Millar and replace him with a bullpen pitcher. If Ortiz could play gold glove 3b, then he'd be even more valuable than a first baseman. If he could drive in 150 runs, play a gold glove 3b, steal 50 bases, and close games out of the bullpen, then he'd be even more valuable.

Pitchers and DHs can win the MVP, obviously. But they have an inherent disadvantage, as they should. If Ortiz had 170 rbis and ARod had 95, there would be no argument. The RBI difference is only 14 or 15 last time I checked.

While some have gotten boosts in the voting because they were good fielders, I challenge you to find me one guy who was ever denied an MVP award because he was a lousy fielder.

It's not just about the rbi, but when you get them. Look at the difference between Arod and Papi with runners in scoring position, in late innings of close games. How many of the rbi and hr, created ties or put his team ahead. It isn't even close.

It's not just about numbers, but how those numbers are perceived by the voters.

When the ballots are cast, they guy who gets the award is likely to be the guy who has better numbers over the next five days. Or the guy who plays on the team that wins the division. Or both.

When the game is on the line, Yankee fans hope A-rod will produce. Sox fans expect Papi to. Why? Cause he does it over and over again.

27: Actually, everybody losing was exactly the same as a win for the Yankees, as they needed five wins last night and need just four today. Of course this everybody losing thing will only work for two more days because starting Friday everybody can't lose because they're playing eachother.

You wrote that fielding is not taken into account by the voters. I write one paragraph in response, and you change the argument to clutch.

ARod's "clutch" numbers are fine. .300+ with power and walks with RISP, same with RISP and two outs, .400+ with bases loaded.

If you think Ortiz' superior RISP BA trumps ARod's gold glove 3b play, then that's your argument. I disagree. At least that's a clear line in the sand.

For what it's worth, I agree that the writers will pick Ortiz as the MVP. It may come down to the final weekend, but that's ignorant and silly to me. If ARod hits 5 hrs over the weekend and Ortiz hits .250 -- or vice versa -- that shouldn't override the previous 159 games. Sheffield is the MVP based on yesterday.

I didn't say that Ortiz would win the MVP. Unless, of course, you think the Sox will win the division. I said that I think the MVP will come from the division winner, whoever that may be. And you'll get no predictions from me.

As for A-Rods gold glove third base play, that is a matter of perception and I think it's a perception the voters share. According to the numbers at BP, A-Rod's defense has cost the Yankees 9 runs over the course of the season in comparison to an average defensive third baseman.

The thing is we remember more of ARod's failures than when he succeeds. The reason being is that we want to keep remembering the dramatic hit. I remember his glove work against Toronto in that one run game (he was big) but I want more. I think many Yankee fans expect more. We see the flashes: the Schilling homerun, the key single vs. the A's, his defense, etc. But those moments of greatness are too spread apart, not lumped together. We want to be reminded again-and-again of his greatness. Papi can go 0 - 22 but then he'll have one key hit and everything is fresh in your memory on why this guy is so dangerous. I'm not sure the same applies for ARod.

Is it our own expectations that are way too high for the guy? I just feel there's something missing to elevate him to that level of Reggie, Jeter, Bernie, Mo or even Sheff.

This is going to be such a long weekend, I really hope Chacon pitches a nice quick game tonight - I don't know about everyone else, but I need sleep!

Finally, on the MVP debate, I say again:

WARP1 (wins above replacement player - includes hitting, baserunning, and defense, adjusted for league and park):
A-Rod: 10.2
Ortiz: 7.7

There is no question who the MVP should be. I'm sure the voters will pick whoever's team wins the AL East.

He doesn't have the confidence of Jeter. Ok well,News Flash, nobody on the planet has the confidence of Jeter.

He doesn't have the determination of Sheffield? Prove that statement and then show how it's germane because I don't even know what it means. Sheff tries harder than A-Rod? Well I've never seen A-Rod lollygag after a ball in the corner, and I've definitely seen Sheff do that.

All these jabs at A-Rod are really pretty sickening. The guy is an AMAZING baseball player. Probably the all around best baseball player we'll ever see in our lifetime and instead of enjoying that, people need to question his determination?

Grow up people, this whole debate is pretty juvenile. If Ortiz wins the MVP it will just prove how subjective and silly the whole award process is. That's why the results on the field are really the only things that matter. They are completely statistcally measurable and not subject to how much you like the cut of someone's jib.

Re: 29, #2 - Do the Yankees need 4 wins or is the magic number (combination of NYY wins and BOS losses) 4?

(And yes I know the condition is also true for BOS, whatever the answer is)

Also, what happened to pitching a SP whose "throw day" it was for a couple of innings? Might the game not have gotten out of hand if we had pitched another SP for two innings and remained ahead going into the 6th??

I really don't know how to respond to the perception that ARod doesn't get big hits.

The game-tying hr off Wickman comes to mind, ninth inning, about to get swept by the Indians. Does that loom kinda large now that you look at the WC standings?

Walk-off single against the Royals. (Ha ha, "walk-off single.")

Ninth-inning double against the Mets, setting up Giambi.

It goes on and on. Plus, all the big hits in the first eight innings that apparently didn't capture your imagination.

See, you're looking at a player who's going to score 120 and drive in 130. No Yankee has done that since 1961. How is it even possible that this production is skewed towards the "meaningless" or "un-clutch"? Have you seen this team play? I wish more of ARod's RBIs were meaningless tack-on runs. That would imply lots of Yankee blowout victories. We could use a few more of those. In all the recent one-run victories, all of the runs seemed kinda meaningful to me.

Hey Debris, news flash, Ortiz is not a 'lousy' fielder - HE'S JUST PLAIN NOT A FIELDER! Unless the numbers are that dramatically different, it's always better to get the offensive numbers from a guy that can contribute in the field as well.

We all know that A-Rod is probably one of the best players ever and Ortiz is simply a great and feared hitter - I'd take A-Rod any day, though I wouldn't mind having both!

(And I can't believe that with this weekend series coming up that anybody gives a rat's ass about the MVP...)

>>And probably next Yankee manager Piniella is on record that Ortiz is the MVP.<<

Uh, wrong, but another nice example of your way of arguing your points, which amounts to baiting.

Piniella is on record as supporting Ortiz deserving "serious consideration" for MVP, and for not having the DH be a disadvantage. This is hardly the same as "being on record" in naming him the MVP.

http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/articles/2005/09/23/ortiz_receives_some_backing/

http://redsox.bostonherald.com/otherMLB/view.bg?articleid=103713

Anyhow, on his determination, I wasn't talking about lollygagging after a fly ball like Sheff - a crime in an of itself. I was referring more to when you want that big hit, that big blow, he seems to fail more than someone like Sheff - not comparing him to Ortiz either because my point was not because of the entire MVP debate. I don't think he tries any less or any more than anyone, that was not my point, you can see that failure bothers him and he's not able to brush it off as easy as Sheff and Jeter. That's a trait you want of your best player - no holds barred, I'm going to get you and I will stomp on your neck if I sense that you are bleeding. There's no disputing that ARod is probably the best player in baseball - five tool guy - but he's not the most feared. Reminds me of a line in the Bronx tale, would you rather be feared or respected? Would you rather ARod be feared or respected? He has the respect - though some Sux fans would debate that point too - but I'd rather he