Baseball Toaster Bronx Banter
The Oakland A's
2007-06-29 11:38
by Cliff Corcoran
Note: The Bronx Banter blog has moved to

When the Yankees visited Oakland in April, the A's weren't scoring very much, but neither were their opponents. Although the Athletics' roster has been devastated by injuries, not much has really changed. The A's have the stingiest pitching staff in the AL despite injuries to the top three men in their bullpen and would-be ace Rich Harden, who has been regulated to relief since being activated last week.

Meanwhile, the offense got Mark Kotsay and Dan Johnson back only to lose Milton Bradley and Mike Piazza, the former's injury problems reaching the point that the A's decided to designate him for assignment rather than deal with them. Jason Kendall is having a historically awful season (39 OPS+), but is still holding on to the starting catching job. Kotsay and former Rookie of the Year Bobby Crosby have been awful (both hitting roughly .240/.290/.350), but Kotsay is still starting over rookie sensation Travis Buck. Eric Chavez is having his worst season since he was a 21-year-old rookie and his third disappointing season in a row, prompting our Toaster colleagues to doubt his commitment to his game. Mix in Shannon Stewart slugging .391 from a corner outfield position and Dan Johnson and Nick Swisher each slugging roughly .450 from first base and right field respectively and you've got a pretty tepid offense that's relying way too much on 28-year-old rookie cleanup hitter Jack Cust. Indeed, the A's have scored the second fewest runs per game in the AL thus far (though Ryan Armbrust points out that they've been better of late--not necessarily good, but better).

What's changed is that when the A's and Yankees last met, the two teams were utter opposites: the Yankees scored a ton of runs and gave up a ton of runs, while the A's did neither. The A's haven't changed, but the Yankees have solved their pitching woes only to see their offense stumble. On the just completed road trip, including the eight innings of last night's suspended game, the Yankees scored 3.22 runs per game and allowed 4.67. The latter number isn't a far cry from their overall season average (4.57), but the former belies their fourth-place major league rank in runs scored per game. In essence, then, the Yankees will have to try to outpitch the A's this weekend, which means they'll likely be helping yet another stumbling team (the A's are 3-9 in their last dozen games entering tonight) get back on stride.

Tonight Kei Igawa tries to outpitch Joe Kennedy. The good news is that Kennedy has walked more than he's struck out this year and has a 7.71 ERA over his last three starts. Igawa, meanwhile, will look to build on his four Steve Austin innings from San Francisco.

Oakland Athletics

2007 Record: 40-38 (.513)
2007 Pythagorean Record: 43-35 (.551)

Manager: Bob Geren
General Manager: Billy Beane

Home Ballpark (2007 Park Factors): McAfee Coliseum (96/97)

Who's Replacing Whom?

Mark Kotsay (DL) replaces Milton Bradley
Jack Cust replaces Mike Piazza (DL)
Dan Johnson (DL) replaces Todd Walker
Kurt Suzuki replaces Adam Melhuse
Lenny DiNardo replaces Rich Harden in the rotation
Santiago Casilla replaces Huston Street (DL)
Colby Lewis replaces Justin Duchscherer (DL)
Ron Flores replaces Kiko Calero (DL)
Dallas Braden replaces Jay Witasick
Ruddy Luggo replaces Bobby Kielty (DL)

25-man Roster:

1B - Dan Johnson (L)
2B - Mark Ellis (R)
SS - Bobby Crosby (R)
3B - Eric Chavez (L)
C - Jason Kendall (R)
RF - Nick Swisher (S)
CF - Mark Kotsay (L)
LF - Shannon Stewart (R)
DH - Jack Cust (L)


R - Marco Scutaro (IF)
L - Travis Buck (RF)
S – Kurt Suzuki (C)


R - Dan Haren
L - Lenny DiNardo
R - Joe Blanton
R - Chad Gaudin
L - Joe Kennedy


L - Alan Embree
R - Santiago Casilla
L - Jay Marshall
R - Rich Harden
R - Colby Lewis
L - Ron Flores
L - Dallas Braden
R - Ruddy Lugo

15-day DL: R - Mike Piazza (DH/C), L - Chris Snelling (OF), R - Huston Street, R - Justin Duchscherer, R - Kiko Calero, R - Connor Robertson
60-day DL: R - Esteban Loaiza, S - Bobby Kielty (OF), R - Chris Denorfia (OF)

Typical Lineup:

R - Shannon Stewart (LF)
L - Mark Kotsay (L)
S - Nick Swisher (1B)
L - Jack Cust (DH)
L - Eric Chavez (3B)
R - Mark Ellis (2B)
L - Dan Johnson (1B)
R - Bobby Crosby (SS)
R - Jason Kendall (C)

Comments (743)
Show/Hide Comments 1-50
2007-06-29 13:02:13
1.   Zack
I believe you mean in the AL, not NL? (not to nitpick. Well, ok, to nitpick)
2007-06-29 13:03:18
2.   Zack
Ok, I swear that when I wrote that it said the NL! I think I am losing it...
2007-06-29 13:30:27
3.   yankz
I bet if you switched some of those names around, you'd get an accurate description of our offense.
2007-06-29 13:45:47
4.   standuptriple
The A's also have studly young bats (Suzuki and Barton) just waiting to replace thier inept "belly full of guts"/underproducing vets. Too bad the Yanks don't have something like that waiting on the farm.
2007-06-29 13:48:05
5.   tommyl
Hey, what are the two numbers in the park factors stat (96/97). I thought there was just one number for park factor?
2007-06-29 13:50:34
6.   Bob Timmermann
Buck was put on the DL and Lugo was sent back to AAA today. The A's called up Danny Murphy (IF) and Dee Brown (OF).
2007-06-29 13:55:37
7.   Start Spreading the News
5 1st number is park factor for hitting. the second for pitching.

any value for either over 100 favors batters.

2007-06-29 13:57:37
8.   tommyl
7 Why are they different? I thought it was just based on runs scored at home versus on the road for a given team. Is the one for pitchers something like runs given up at home versus runs given up on the road?
2007-06-29 13:58:28
9.   cult of basebaal
Cabrera CF
Jeter SS
Matsui LF
Rodriquez 3B
Posada DH
Abreu RF
Phillips 1B
Cano 2B
Nieves C
2007-06-29 14:10:14
10.   MVB
This month, the Yankees:

- won two of three against New York ( 44-33)

- lost two in a row to Baltimore (33-43)

- won two of three against Boston ( 48-29)

- lost two of three to San Fransisco ( 33-44)

- swept the D'Backs ( 45-35)

- were swept by Colorado ( 38-41)

The New York Yankees are unpredictable... just watch them go sweep this weekend series.

2007-06-29 14:21:54
11.   ChrisS
9 not an awful lineup, but I think Groundzilla is hitting far too high in the order.
2007-06-29 14:43:25
12.   Zack
Ugh, Nieves. At least Cairo isn't playing 1b, which i thought for sure would happen...
2007-06-29 14:45:25
13.   JL25and3
Are you guys still here?
2007-06-29 14:47:21
14.   RIYank
12 When Andy dropped down that bunt yesterday, my first thought was "Oh, stupid move", but then I realized that Torre would be impressed and he'd get another shot sooner.
2007-06-29 15:12:36
15.   JL25and3
14 Speaking of which, I heard Joe explain why he had Cano bunt with Posada on first the other night: he didn't. Cano missed the sign.

Of all the problems with this team, the presence of Nieves is the most embarrassing and the most inexplicable. Starting catchers might be hard to find, but bad backup catchers are always available. None of them can be worse than Nieves.

The Orioles DFA'd Alberto Castillo. I can't believe I'm saying this, but the Yankees should see if they can get him. He's merely awful, which would be an improvement.

2007-06-29 15:19:48
16.   weeping for brunnhilde
9 Wait a can Nieves be catching tonight if Moose is pitching tomorrow?


2007-06-29 15:22:00
17.   yankee23
16 Pete Ab has it that Moose is pitching tonight, is that right?
2007-06-29 15:23:33
18.   yankee23
2007-06-29 15:31:34
19.   weeping for brunnhilde
17 Yeah, I don't know. I've heard both. Cliff has Igawa set to throw...

Quelle mystere!

2007-06-29 15:34:25
20.   randym77
Gameday says Moose...
2007-06-29 15:34:45
21.   RIYank
The Yanks' MLB page says it's Moose today. Makes sense. He doesn't like the extra rest day, generally.
2007-06-29 15:59:52
22.   JL25and3
Oh, great. That means I get to see Igawa tomorrow. I've had an amazing streak this year, 7-0 in games I've been through, but tomorrow's going to be a challenge.
2007-06-29 16:11:29
23.   thelarmis
way to start 'em moose. nothin' i like more than a leadoff walk! i hope this is not a portend of things to come...
2007-06-29 16:15:06
24.   Mattpat11
And Nieves rolls the ball to second.
2007-06-29 16:16:11
25.   Mattpat11
That was a makeup call.
2007-06-29 16:19:09
26.   Mattpat11
What in Christ was that play Matsui?
2007-06-29 16:19:28
27.   Mattpat11
26 Not that I'll fight the result.
2007-06-29 16:22:30
28.   randym77
Remember when Melky was a horrendous bunter?
2007-06-29 16:22:39
29.   bartap74
Someone needs to de-activate Jeter's bunting mechanism.
2007-06-29 16:22:41
30.   Javi Javi
nice bunty, melky
2007-06-29 16:23:43
31.   thelarmis
nothin' like the back-to-back bunt plan from the bronx banter!
2007-06-29 16:26:52
32.   bobtaco
Oh, oh, there goes another rally, yo. Groundzilla.
2007-06-29 16:26:58
33.   bartap74
Hmmm...salty pretzels and gummi bears make for a pretty yummy combination. I know, apropos of nothing.
2007-06-29 16:31:06
34.   Javi Javi
Oh man, what a sweet swing.
2007-06-29 16:31:30
35.   cult of basebaal
another attempt at a botched offensive inning, ruined that dastardly choker, sneedly rodriguez
2007-06-29 16:31:55
36.   tommyl
Where this team would be without A-Rod and Posada is scary.
2007-06-29 16:32:12
37.   bobtaco
Love those two out RBI hits.
2007-06-29 16:32:31
38.   bartap74
I'd like the inning even better if Jeter hadn't given the first out away. Still, it's nice to see some signs of life.
2007-06-29 16:39:29
39.   Mattpat11
2007-06-29 16:39:44
40.   tommyl
Oh no, please do not bring back mxxzsdfy in August.
2007-06-29 16:43:48
41.   Mattpat11
40 Especially is Phillips proves me wrong and starts to hit.
2007-06-29 16:44:16
42.   randym77
And Andy hits a home run in an elevator.

Better hit, kid, or it's gonna be Cairo in the lineup tomorrow.

2007-06-29 16:45:58
43.   Mattpat11
Nieves was disappointed with his shit play in San Francisco?

No fucking shit.

Oh Jesus. Igawa is going tomorrow.

2007-06-29 16:47:22
44.   Mattpat11
Holy shit.
2007-06-29 16:48:23
45.   cult of basebaal
man, that's a sad indictment of wil nieves, merely giving up a hit to him is enough to bring the pitching coach to the mound ...
2007-06-29 16:52:47
46.   Mattpat11
2007-06-29 16:52:59
47.   pistolpete
2007-06-29 16:56:54
48.   pistolpete
Leave it to Abreu to make even the routine pop-ups looks scary - yeesh!
2007-06-29 16:57:03
49.   Mattpat11
That wasn't a particularly coordinated play there by Yankees
2007-06-29 16:57:47
50.   pistolpete
Nice play Melky calling off Bobble Abreu...
Show/Hide Comments 51-100
2007-06-29 17:03:13
51.   tommyl
Wow A-Rod is good
2007-06-29 17:05:07
52.   Mattpat11
44 pitches through 3 for Mussina, FWIW
2007-06-29 17:05:43
53.   tommyl
Man Bobby, what happened to the bunt?

Ah, now we're back to the Yankees I know and love.

2007-06-29 17:05:59
54.   RIYank
I was about to comment on how dumb it is to walk Posada in that situation when Abreu vindicates the move. Ugh.
2007-06-29 17:07:04
55.   cult of basebaal
2007-06-29 17:07:14
56.   RIYank
52 Hm, on track for seven. Good, because the bullpen will be needed tomorrow.
2007-06-29 17:12:11
57.   Mattpat11
Nice play
2007-06-29 17:12:33
58.   RIYank
Good D for us today -- even Abreu made the play he started wrong.
2007-06-29 17:14:14
59.   Mattpat11
54 through 4. He can go 8.
2007-06-29 17:18:07
60.   RIYank
59 Those first-pitch hits don't exactly hurt his pitch count!
2007-06-29 17:19:05
61.   tommyl
How sad is it that A-Rod's BA is greater than Nieves OPS?
2007-06-29 17:20:50
62.   RIYank
What the--
Who stole our defense???
2007-06-29 17:23:03
63.   RIYank
61 Also Nieves OBP is lower than my weight. That's sad in two ways, for me.

Wow, five innings 62 pitches for Moose. Now on pace for a CG!

2007-06-29 17:41:59
64.   claybeez
I was terrified watching that play.
2007-06-29 17:44:02
65.   OldYanksFan
If Mats dove for those ball with his arm extended in front of him, wouldn't there be less chance of bending that wrist backward? Not no mention he would catch these balls.
2007-06-29 17:45:22
66.   RIYank
More good D. Matsui with an assist!
But Moose is getting away with murder.
2007-06-29 17:46:49
67.   weeping for brunnhilde
Hey Team.

So, do we rely on Mike for the 7th?

History would seem to suggest that trotting him back out there is to play with fire.

Vizcaino's been throwing well of late...

2007-06-29 17:48:20
68.   Marcus
67 I think you have to start him in the 7th, no question. He's only at 78 pitches.

If he walks the leadoff hitter, start warming up the bullpen.

2007-06-29 17:48:42
69.   weeping for brunnhilde
28 I was thinking the same thing, randy. He used to pop the ball straight up in the air like Derek did.
2007-06-29 17:49:04
70.   RIYank
67 His pitch count is ridiculously low. 76! At that rate he should pitch the eighth.

But you're right about recent history. Short leash? Don't forget, Kei Igawa tomorrow means we need the bullpen.

2007-06-29 17:49:41
71.   weeping for brunnhilde
68 I guess, but it's only two runs and Mike has a tendency to unravel in a hurry.

I'm not trying to jinx anything, but I hope you can appreciate my apprehension...

2007-06-29 17:51:13
72.   RIYank
71 Right. But Vizcaino can give up runs fast too. I dunno. I like Moose for the seventh, but without great confidence.
2007-06-29 17:52:05
73.   RIYank
Mean while, Kennedy has thrown 100. But would we hit their bullpen better than we've hit Kennedy? I think not.
2007-06-29 17:52:39
74.   Marcus
71 I do, but I trust in Nieves's ability to get the best out of Mussina.

But seriously, I think you have to get the bullpen ready at the first sign of trouble.

2007-06-29 17:56:22
75.   OldYanksFan
Nick almost took one on the head there. Could have been dangerous, would have looked pretty funny.
2007-06-29 17:56:27
76.   tommyl
I do not like this game at all. Moose is pitching well, but it won't last, and then its the parade of crappy bullpen arms. The offense is once again A-Rod and a few other hangars on. We should be up 5-0 at this point.

Abreu just looks awful at the plate.

2007-06-29 17:56:36
77.   RIYank
Robbie allowed us to clear Nieves, anyway. Maybe get a couple of runs in the seventh and make everyone feel a little bit comfortable?
2007-06-29 17:57:57
78.   tommyl
Can you let a pitcher hit and keep the DH? If so, we could DH Posada and let any pitcher hit over Nieves. Seriously, why is he still on this team?
2007-06-29 18:00:13
79.   RIYank
Is Moose tiring, or is this just his luck catching up with him?
2007-06-29 18:02:23
80.   bobtaco
79 Luck just bailed him out.
2007-06-29 18:03:39
81.   RIYank
Yeah. Though reversing the order (shallow pop then GIDP) would have been luckier.
2007-06-29 18:08:11
82.   weeping for brunnhilde
74 ha ha ah ah aha h!!

Well, we got out of the seventh, so that's good!

Now some runs, Team, some runs!

2007-06-29 18:10:24
83.   RIYank
Jeter looks bad today, damnit.
2007-06-29 18:12:02
84.   weeping for brunnhilde
Ok, so here's an observation about Derek.

He bunted that terrible bunt in the first. Terrible in execution, apparently terrible in conceit.

But Flaherty mentioned that maybe Derek didn't feel right swinging the bat in BP, so maybe he felt his best chance tonight was to bunt.

Then he goes down looking twice this game.

Maybe Flaherty was on to something?

Just a thought.

2007-06-29 18:14:02
85.   RIYank
84 Both times it was a fastball under the hands. For whatever that's worth.
2007-06-29 18:15:21
86.   Mattpat11
2007-06-29 18:15:42
87.   claybeez
Cairo in? Did Andy get hurt on that earlier play?
2007-06-29 18:16:50
88.   RIYank
87 No, he's in for defensive purposes.
2007-06-29 18:17:29
89.   RIYank

I want Mo here.

2007-06-29 18:17:43
90.   tommyl
Here we go again
2007-06-29 18:17:46
91.   Mattpat11
I hate Farnsworth
2007-06-29 18:18:06
92.   RIYank
89 Yes! He's throwing!
2007-06-29 18:18:57
93.   williamnyy23
Forget about the result...bringing in Farnsworth is iron clad evidence that it is time for Joe to go (and that he has been costing them games all season).
2007-06-29 18:19:01
94.   claybeez
88 That's ridiculous.
2007-06-29 18:19:23
95.   tommyl
To: Joe Torre
Re: Kyle Farnsworth
From: Common Sense


2007-06-29 18:20:07
96.   tommyl
94 Andy failed to make the play on the line drive screamer. Its clear Cairo's bellyfull of guts would have knocked it down.
2007-06-29 18:20:46
97.   RIYank
91 Farns loves you though, Mattpat11.

And here's Mo for the 4-out save! Goooood call.

2007-06-29 18:21:09
98.   tommyl
Hahahahaha, Joe got my memo!

Remember in ST when Joe said Mo would be a 1 inning pitcher only this season?

2007-06-29 18:21:31
99.   williamnyy23
Great...Farnsworth is upset...maybe he'll do something to get on Joe's bad side, which is the only way to prevent him from pitching important innings.
2007-06-29 18:21:40
100.   claybeez
96 Oh, yeah. I forgot to check the bellyfull of guts ranks, today. Thank goodness Joe keeps on top of these things.
Show/Hide Comments 101-150
2007-06-29 18:21:42
101.   Mattpat11
Mussina's ERA is down to 4.62 with a 3.68 in June
2007-06-29 18:22:52
102.   Mattpat11
Can we please trade him?
2007-06-29 18:23:21
103.   williamnyy23
I wish someone on the bench would hold Farnsworth's stat sheet in front of his face and ask: "What's the problem"?
2007-06-29 18:23:37
104.   Mattpat11
102 Farnsworth, not Mussina
2007-06-29 18:23:38
105.   williamnyy23
103 In fact, I'd like it to be Clemens.
2007-06-29 18:24:20
106.   williamnyy23
Shut up Flaherty1
2007-06-29 18:25:48
107.   Mattpat11
105 That could be fun.
2007-06-29 18:25:58
108.   cult of basebaal
105 i'd prefer it was Nieves, then the resulting brawl would remove 2 problems at once ...
2007-06-29 18:26:54
109.   RIYank
Yeah, Mo.
Whew. One of those crappy broken bat singles would have sucked.
2007-06-29 18:27:11
110.   tommyl
And that Kyle is why you sit down and shut up.
2007-06-29 18:27:27
111.   Mattpat11
See Kyle, sometimes when we have three ball counts, we can do that instead of walking the guy
2007-06-29 18:27:36
112.   randym77
Yeah, hang your head, Farnsy. You should.
2007-06-29 18:27:37
113.   williamnyy23
Classic Mo...unfortunately, he had to use a lot of energy to clean Farnsworth's mess.
2007-06-29 18:29:30
114.   Eirias
102 Who the HELL are we going to get for Farnsworth?
2007-06-29 18:31:01
115.   tommyl
Wow, A-Rod is really good.
2007-06-29 18:32:31
116.   RIYank
114 Everyone's hoping some team, maybe NL, will see his 'stuff' and be fooled. Like, uh, a certain intelligent GM we know once was, and a manager we know still is.
2007-06-29 18:33:02
117.   Mattpat11
114 Who the hell cares?
2007-06-29 18:33:35
118.   randym77
114 Maybe Hatteberg, from the Reds?

They just had to use three pitchers to get through one inning. Gave up three runs. And the lead. Again.

2007-06-29 18:34:11
119.   Mattpat11
114 Who the hell cares?
2007-06-29 18:34:26
120.   RIYank
118 Just one hitch: Hatteberg sucks.
2007-06-29 18:36:52
121.   randym77
Did Torre really put Miggy in as a defensive replacement for Andy Phillips? o_O
2007-06-29 18:37:20
122.   Marcus
There's got to be some middling BUC we could get for Farnsworth. Maybe get a BUC and a B-level prospect?
2007-06-29 18:37:54
123.   Marcus
122 That's assuming the Yanks pay a good portion of Farny's salary.
2007-06-29 18:38:25
124.   RIYank
Damn, that could have been Andy against a lefty. Oh well.
2007-06-29 18:38:32
125.   randym77
120 I'd rather have Hatteberg than Hillenbrand.
2007-06-29 18:38:50
126.   tommyl
120 .299/.388/.468 with 7 HRs, compared to Cairo? Are you kidding me?
2007-06-29 18:39:32
127.   tommyl
Why didn't he use his magical BFOG? That's like +10 to batting says my rulebook.
2007-06-29 18:40:12
128.   weeping for brunnhilde
Well it would seem we have ourselves a ballgame, friends.
2007-06-29 18:40:18
129.   williamnyy23
120 Hatteberg doesn't suck. He is just below average, which, unfortunately, is a massive upgrade.
2007-06-29 18:41:23
130.   RIYank
126 129 He's no better than Andy.
2007-06-29 18:43:40
131.   RIYank
Miggy slurps up the pop fly!
2007-06-29 18:43:59
132.   williamnyy23
Farnsworth's contract has a funny incentive:

*may earn additional $0.5M annually if he leads club in Rolaids relief points

2007-06-29 18:44:06
133.   tommyl
130 Based on what analysis?
2007-06-29 18:44:46
134.   RIYank
Rivera in action.
Now let's hope the fourth out isn't too many to ask for...
2007-06-29 18:44:52
135.   Eirias
127 Bag Full of Goodies or Big F!@#-Off Gun?
2007-06-29 18:45:04
136.   RIYank
Dang, it was!
2007-06-29 18:45:52
137.   tommyl
Doesn't the batter have to make an effort to avoid the ball to get the base? He literally stepped into that.
2007-06-29 18:46:01
138.   cult of basebaal
126 splits, people, splits ... he's hitting .235 .345 .357 .702 away from the friendly confines of GAB
2007-06-29 18:46:16
139.   tommyl
135 Belly full of Guts
2007-06-29 18:46:46
140.   RIYank

I love baseball.

2007-06-29 18:47:08
141.   randym77
Baseball Think Factory picked Hatteberg as the best defensive first baseman in the NL last year. And he hits a heck of a lot better than Minky.
2007-06-29 18:47:43
142.   Marcus
1-run victory, folks.
2007-06-29 18:48:30
143.   williamnyy23
138 His career OPS+ is 100 and his 2007 OPS+ is 117. Hatteberg is an average bat rendered below average by his position. He would still be a huge upgrade over Cairo/Phillips.
2007-06-29 18:48:58
144.   bobtaco
Yay. Yanks actually win a one run game. Satisfying.
2007-06-29 18:50:58
145.   RIYank
143 See 138. He's a weak hitter who looks better than he is because of a hitter's park.

Some years ago, he was better. But now he isn't. And he's a schmuck.

142 Good point, those have been few and far between!

2007-06-29 18:51:16
146.   williamnyy23
The Yankees now have a 1 15/18 game winning streak.
2007-06-29 18:52:19
147.   williamnyy23
145 See 143. OPS+ accounts for home ball park.
2007-06-29 18:55:37
148.   RIYank
147 Hm, okay, this year he's hitting better, you're right.
2007-06-29 18:55:56
149.   randym77
Hattteberg has hit reasonably well his whole career. He's only been a Red since last year. He's not a .235 hitter.
2007-06-29 18:58:58
150.   williamnyy23
Some math on the potential deal:

2007 Yankees+Hatteberg-Farnsworth-Cairo/Phillips=significant improvement

Show/Hide Comments 151-200
2007-06-29 19:00:37
151.   RIYank
149 I remember some anemic years with Boston.
2007-06-29 19:00:47
152.   Max
One run win! All thanks to our discussion of Sun Ra in the weird game/non-game thread yesterday. Hope he sends more good vibes from Saturn for succeeding close ones.
2007-06-29 19:02:23
153.   RIYank
150 It's hard not to find that equation compelling. The negative terms are especially intriguing.
2007-06-29 19:03:36
154.   tommyl
151 Is he better than Miguel Cairo? I think I feel safe saying, yes.
2007-06-29 19:03:39
155.   JL25and3
152 I was just getting ready to make a post about Sun Ra as the hero of the game. And I thought I was being so clever...

New Yankee slogan: Space is the place!

2007-06-29 19:06:16
156.   Kered Retej
Nice to see Mo actually pitch in a meaningful situation.
2007-06-29 19:07:04
157.   williamnyy23
The Pirates have this guy Phelps who might be an interesting option...maybe they'd trade him for Farnsworth?
2007-06-29 19:12:19
158.   Mattpat11
I'd trade Farnsworth for pocket lint
2007-06-29 19:23:59
159.   weeping for brunnhilde
As always, I feel privileged that we've had Mo for all these years.

He's one-of-a-kind.

2007-06-29 19:25:21
160.   Shaun P
157 But according to BFOG+ (a wonderful stat Bama developed, it adjusts standard BFOG for veteran-ness, body size, height, and league), Phelps is -115. Torre would never play a guy with a BFOG+ that low.

158 Rivsy (Krivsky, the Reds GM, but without the Ks - because he hates when batters strikeout - I borrowed this from Keith Law) would give the Yanks more than pocket lint, or Conine, or Hatteburg. I really think Dunn could be had for a package built around Krazy Kyle.

142 152 155 Maybe Sun Ra will send a few more of these one-run victories the Yanks' way!

2007-06-29 19:35:47
161.   weeping for brunnhilde
What if someone were able to convince Joe that Mo should be used both in save situations and in potential decisions.

Then he could pitch the ninth in a tie game on the road.

Maybe someone who has Joe's ear (does any of his coaches have his ear?) should suggest to Joe that W's are as legitimate a pursuit for Mo as Sv's.


2007-06-29 19:39:14
162.   weeping for brunnhilde
Oh, and wtf with Farnsworth, man?

Where the fuck does he get off showing attitude?

What unmitigated gall.

Sit the fuck down, Kyle.

I once mused that maybe Farnsworth could actually be straightened out, at least that it was plausible.

I no longer think it's plausible, unless he has some kind of conversion experience and finds humility, he's irredemable.

Either he or his head must be off, and that in about half no-time.

2007-06-29 19:43:53
163.   OldYanksFan
While he hasn't in a while, Hattteberg was the BUC with Boston. Complained he didn't play enough. So he's better then Nieves at C and better then Cairo at 1st. With Hatty, we could dump Nieves, and Phillips if we can find a better bat to replace him.
2007-06-29 20:15:14
164.   Shaun P
163 A while is right, OYF - the last game Hatteberg caught was in 2001. I don't think he'll be behind the plate anytime soon. His RATE his last 3 years catching: 94, 76, 55. Ugh. Our pipe dreams last summer of Craig Wilson being the BUC were dashed, too.

What about Sal Fasano?

2007-06-29 20:42:51
165.   Yu-Hsing Chen
Wow, anyone checking out the Padre/Dodger game, Chris YOung + Michael Barrett = better throw a perfecto or else...
2007-06-29 22:45:45
166.   tommyl
Edwar Ramirez pitched 3 perfect innings with 6Ks. In 26.2 AAA innings, he has given up 13 hits and 9 walks, while striking out 47.

Jesus, please, please dump Kyle and call him up.

2007-06-29 22:53:08
167.   tommyl
166 47! 47 strikeouts in 26.2 innings. Seriously, what do you have to do to earn a callup with this team?!

His WHIP is 0.82. His K/BB ratio is over 5. Want a coarse stat, his ERA in AAA is 0.76. He's given up 2 runs.

While I don't think he's the next Mo (there never will be), shouldn't we see if he's the next Tom Gordon? or Mike Stanton?

2007-06-30 00:05:04
168.   Vandelay Industries
If those are indeed the stats, I don't see why not. How old is the kid?

Red Sox have a Nascar sponsorship? Have to hand it to them, they tapped in to the most loyal fan base in the history of sport, in terms of merchandising and brand loyalty.

2007-06-30 02:58:53
169.   Yu-Hsing Chen
Rameriez is a little old, 26, but plenty of RPs have come up and established themself at older ages and be effective at least a few year. we really need to unload Farnsworth / Villone and probalby Vizcaino too to give Rameriez / Britton some chances.
2007-06-30 05:39:02
170.   Charenton
152 155
rather enjoyably shocked to find references to Sounds of Joy here !
Reflections in Blue:
Are you aware of the fact that Dodger catcher Russell Martin's middle name is "Coltrane": named after the great one…
2007-06-30 06:28:37
171.   monkeypants
OK, I'm late to this party--missed last night's game entirely. Farnsworth is getting skewered for his actions after being taken out of the game, and most of what I am reading accuses him of "showing up the manager" or "complaining about being replaced by Rivera." There is also general bitterness that he refused to talk to the press. Now, I am not one to defend Farnsworth (And I didn't see what happened), but is it possible that his tantrum in the dugout was more about frustration at not pitching well? In other words, was it aimed at himself, rather than the manager?

What did you guys see?

2007-06-30 06:53:06
172.   Jim Dean
171 I also missed the game - date night with the wife (Ratatouille = Fantastic film!). I had the same question.

And since we kill Joe (and he should be fired) he does get credit from me for DH'ing Jorge with no third catcher. What a novel idea!

Then he goes and undoes that creativity with Cairo as LIDR?

Otherwise - what did Farnsy do?

2007-06-30 07:40:17
173.   JL25and3
It sure looked like he was pissed at being taken out rather than at not pitching well. At least, it didn't start until Joe came out to get him.

170 That's completely awesome. Russell Nathan Coltrane Jeanson Martin. My new favorite non-Yankee, as long as I forget that he's on my least-favorite team.

2007-06-30 07:42:52
174.   tommyl
171, 172 Farnsworth had two on, and got to two outs. Joe comes out and calls for Mo. Kyle is clearly pissed off. As he is walking off the mound, he starts shaking his head and quite clearly mouthng, "Fucking Joke" over and over. Then he gets to the dugout and hurls his glove and generally throws a tantrum.

Look, I think Joe should probably go, but that's based on baseball reasons. I still think he's been a great manager, player and more importantly a man. You do not do that, especially in public. If Kyle has a problem with being taken out he should:

a) Try not sucking and putting two-three men on every time.
b) Take it up with Joe in private. If there's one thing you can say about Joe, his door is always open and he's willing to talk.

2007-06-30 07:43:27
175.   weeping for brunnhilde
171 See for yourself, mp--do you have YES?

The rebroadcast is on now, and they're in the 7th, so you can check out Kyle's theatrics.

The guy walked off the mound barking, got to the dugout throwing a tantrum and (as my wife noticed with great amusement) the whole team ignored him, walking away, giving him room to hang himself.

Sure, he could have just been raging at himself, but he seemed kind of petulant, as if he'd been mistreated. And didn't he show up Melky last week, too?

Either way, it's one thing for a Paul O'Neill or Moose to behave like that, but Farnsworth just hasn't earned to right to act out.

2007-06-30 07:47:24
176.   JL25and3
By the way, I don't know if anyone's commented on the most remarkable thing about last night's game - 2:38. Holy 1968, Batman!
2007-06-30 08:03:27
177.   Jim Dean
174 Excellent - thanks!

176 No kidding! We went to the 7:30pm movie after dinner. And when we got to a bar afterwards I was shocked when the game was over.

Moose pitch well and/or was the defense as good as Tyler makes it sound?

2007-06-30 08:14:45
178.   Jim Dean
Ed Ramirez last night with 6 K in 3 IP (0 BB).
2007-06-30 08:50:30
179.   OldYanksFan
171 While Farns was clearly out of line (and out of his mind), I for one like see passion like that, even if it's misdirected. It means at least he cares about both his performance and the game.

The guy had good stuff. I don't know why he's pitching so badly. Must have abreuitis.

2007-06-30 09:37:59
180.   yankz
I know he's not a good defensive player, but Jeter's jump throw thingy play last night was remarkable.

Don't get me wrong, I want Nieves off the team as much as the rest of you. But he really does have a good BFOG+ (remember that day he caught the entire game with an injured hand because he knew the team needed it?)

And does anyone else think Cano should bat 3? He'll get a steady diet of fastballs, which might revive his power stroke. It's not like the others we throw out there are tearing it up.

2007-06-30 10:14:55
181.   Yankee Fan in Chicago
Side retired in order in the 1st on 9 pitches, 7 strikes:

It's Igawa's world, we just live in it.

2007-06-30 10:17:38
182.   51cq24
i missed the end of last night's game also. was farnsworth so out of line that maybe the front office will do something about it? like trade him?
2007-06-30 10:21:17
183.   Eirias
As much as I'd like to see Edwar Ramirez brought up (and I'd REALLY like to see Ramirez brought up), I find it difficult to believe that Torre would put his faith in a rookie that mainly throws a changeup (albeit a plus-plus changeup).
2007-06-30 10:23:44
184.   DadinIowa
Does anyone have this week's magic URL for

On a more relevant point, get rid of Farnsworth. He can't be trusted in the 8th (or before)


2007-06-30 10:24:02
185.   yankz
Sun Ra is dandy, but we and the boys need to channel some Polyphonic Spree. Big team effort, cheery, motivated, and awesome.
2007-06-30 10:31:01
186.   Yankee Fan in Chicago
Can the Yanks muster even a shred of offense to support Cy Igawa?
2007-06-30 10:34:29
187.   Jim Dean
183 Another reason he needs to be fired.

But I suspect that's also the reason they Yanks haven't brought him up much. The Yanks rely pretty heavily on looks moreso than results (see also: Colter bean, Andy Phillips). Borderline prospects have a really hard time breaking through and sticking.

2007-06-30 10:34:39
188.   OldYanksFan
184 wizofoz01 at comcast dot net for today's link
2007-06-30 10:36:51
189.   weeping for brunnhilde
180 Hey, yankz, that's a really intriguing idea.

I like it a lot. It might be just the way to maximize Cano's potential. Of course to do that would be to give up on him becoming a great hitter because he'd be dependent on hitting before the game's best hitter (HA! I just called Alex the game's best hitter! Don't tell RI...).

Hmmm. Not a bad idea...

2007-06-30 10:37:24
190.   Yankee Fan in Chicago
Well, at least we made Gaudin work -- 10 pitches that inning vs 8 in the 1st.
2007-06-30 10:39:36
191.   DadinIowa
OldYanksFan, I went to comcast, but not a member, and not sure how to find wizofoz01. I'm in Iowa, does that matter?

BTW, what happened to our bats? This is the SECOND multi, multi-game run drought this year?

2007-06-30 10:43:03
192.   OldYanksFan
No. That's my email address. drop me a line.
2007-06-30 10:43:30
193.   OldYanksFan
330' HR
2007-06-30 10:43:51
194.   cult of basebaal
dear god, it's a good thing igawa hasn't been here long enough to realize how pathetic it is to give up a home run to jason kendall ... his family's honor would demand satisfaction ... SEPPUKU BEHIND THE MOUND!
2007-06-30 10:44:22
195.   randym77
Ugh. Looks like we got the bad Igawa today.
2007-06-30 10:44:28
196.   cult of basebaal
2007-06-30 10:46:45
197.   cult of basebaal
man, igawa's BFoG+ is off the charts ... but in the wrong way ... he just falls apart at a moment's notice, it seems ...
2007-06-30 10:46:59
198.   Yankee Fan in Chicago
Didn't one of ours give up Kendall's only other homer this season? Pathetic.
2007-06-30 10:49:01
199.   cult of basebaal
nope, he hit it in houston ... we're off the hook ... sorta
2007-06-30 10:49:14
200.   51cq24
195 as opposed to?
Show/Hide Comments 201-250
2007-06-30 10:49:36
201.   Bob Timmermann
Kendall's first homer was against Chris Sampson of Houston.
2007-06-30 10:50:53
202.   cult of basebaal
maybe joe should order a "code red" on igawa ...
2007-06-30 10:52:09
203.   standuptriple
Torre gets Villone up in the pen. So you potentially replace a soft-tossing LH with a soft-tossing LH? Luckily Igawa gets out o it, but I just don't see the logic.
2007-06-30 10:55:35
204.   weeping for brunnhilde
So my kid asks "Why didn't he swing at that?" regarding that 1-0 pitch to Cano.

Fastball up and on the outer half of the plate.

He could have smacked that hard with authority to left.

Instead he hits another weakass grounder on a low pitch--slider?

Maybe he's thinking too much about being patient?

God, I'd love to see him straightened out.

2007-06-30 10:56:18
205.   cult of basebaal
well, because torre couldn't be bothered to use sean henn, who was put on the roster specifically for these situations, he got sent back to AAA so he could actually, you know, pitch, leaving our pal Ronnie as pretty much the only option if a starter gets knocked out early
2007-06-30 10:56:41
206.   yankz
189 Maybe it could be a sparkplug? Let's say there's a runner on base. Where he is right now, Cano feels all the pressure, because he knows it's a long line of riffraff behind him if he fails to get the RBI. But with A-God behind him, he might have a little more fun and not worry as much about failing.

"You can't be afraid to fail; if you are, you will be afraid to try."-Captain Clutch

2007-06-30 10:57:50
207.   Zack
The Joe Torre quick hook vs the Joe Torre slow hook is mind boggling, isn't it? I guess it is based purely on BFOG+, but sometimes it doesn't seem that way. I think its more of the Joe Torre Doghouse Syndrome (JTDS?)-you're either in it or not in it, and actual performance doesn't seem to matter as much as attitude and, I suppose, BFOG+. They are obviously interrelated.
2007-06-30 10:58:50
208.   Zack
Its also mind boggling that this team has three hitters in the top five BA in the AL, yet is so pathetic otherwise
2007-06-30 11:01:42
209.   Zack
When was the last time A-Rod actually messed up a pop-up? Must we rehash this every single day kay?
2007-06-30 11:02:58
210.   Zack
It seems like when Hughes comes back, Igawa might not be a bad (relatively speaking) middle releiver, no? He seems to be good for about 3 decent innings...
2007-06-30 11:03:13
211.   Zack
And I'm now talking to myself, awesome
2007-06-30 11:07:07
212.   yankz
211 I didn't want to jinx your streak.
2007-06-30 11:08:13
213.   standuptriple
I'm still here. Bay Area Represent! How'd I miss the BFOG+? I have no idea what that means.
2007-06-30 11:08:22
214.   cult of basebaal
yes, it was bringing us good igawa, from now on, only zack can talk when igawa is on the mound!
2007-06-30 11:09:23
215.   cult of basebaal
Belly Full of Guts! the + means it's adjusted for park and league ...
2007-06-30 11:09:46
216.   Zack
214 Hmm, that seems like a mighty commitment on all of our parts, and I might get a bit lonely...

The more pressing concern seems to be how to get this freaking team to hit tho

2007-06-30 11:09:54
217.   Yankee Fan in Chicago
Hey, one of our hitters got the ball out of the infield. Huzzah.
2007-06-30 11:11:13
218.   Zack
No Gaudin-artistic pitching jokes yet? Eh, eh? A "master" of "painting" the corners? Come on, I'm here all week....
2007-06-30 11:11:32
219.   Yankee Fan in Chicago
Anyone else notice that we're being no-hit.


Chad Gaudin has no-hit us through 4.

He's pitching a no-hitter.

2007-06-30 11:12:18
220.   standuptriple
215 Thanks. It's still early on the West Coast.
Well, I've never seen a no-hitter before. Maybe today will be the day. Of course my opponent this week in fantasy has Gaudin going today. Keep on twisting the knife Yanks.
2007-06-30 11:14:19
221.   Zack
ignore me, I'm obviously insane
2007-06-30 11:15:13
222.   Zack
Gauguin, guadin...close enough for me...
2007-06-30 11:15:23
223.   Zack
I need more sleep I guess...
2007-06-30 11:15:48
224.   Zack
And I am clearly talking to myself again..

Hey, a DP on a pitch down! Whaddayaknow?

2007-06-30 11:16:12
225.   Zack
Crud, another nice inning, I might have to keep this up...
2007-06-30 11:18:05
226.   standuptriple
I'm more of a Matisse guy.
2007-06-30 11:18:48
227.   cult of basebaal
now we just have to figure out what it is you have to do in the bottom halves to get the yankees' bats untracked
2007-06-30 11:19:18
228.   standuptriple
Or Matissiu if you will...(see I can be crazy too...hmm...what do we have in common...Yanks fans...causation? I think so)
2007-06-30 11:19:32
229.   Zack
I think someone else has to take over the Yanks' half innings, I only have so much to give
2007-06-30 11:21:55
230.   standuptriple
229 Just ask one of the other personalities in your sub-conscious to chime in.
2007-06-30 11:22:28
231.   cult of basebaal
man ... just by looking at their gameday pictures, you'd think half the A's team spent their afternoons ripping bong hits in their basements
2007-06-30 11:23:10
232.   Zack
These damn impressionists...All colors and brush strokes and light...Give me Dada any day...
2007-06-30 11:23:41
233.   Zack
You know, I really do have a dissertation to be writing here...
2007-06-30 11:23:52
234.   cult of basebaal
man ... i'm gonna start calling robby, "sniper" ... you know, after the sniper's credo ... "one shot, one kill" ... course, for robby, it's more like ... "one pitch, one out" ...
2007-06-30 11:24:08
235.   Zack
Of course, that explains why I am actively avoiding doing any work as well I suppose
2007-06-30 11:24:16
236.   fansince77
I am no hitting coach but if I see another game of at least 5-7 weakly pulled ground balls to second base or short stop I am going to slit my wrists. It doesn't take a genius to see that the Yankees approach at the plate has sucked big time over the past two weeks- cano, matsui, abreu, cabrera, cairo, even jeter alot lately "and there is another ground ball to second base (shortstop) ..." Wake the ()&^ up and go up the middle!
2007-06-30 11:26:39
237.   Zack
hmm, lunch anybody?
2007-06-30 11:27:18
238.   thelarmis
i'm just checking in. did igawa really give up a homer to jason freaking kendall? good lord! back-to-back homers only to be followed up w/ back-to-back walks, for good measure.

we're being NO HIT!!! ugh...

we should certainly try ramirez and britton in the pen. farns is a complete farse.

yeah, russell martin is a good story. he grew up in france, with his mom and also canada, with his dad. his pop was a street musician and very supportive of his son. that's where the "coltrane" middle name came from. very very cool!

those of you in NY, should go check out trane's son Ravi, if you have the chance. he's an excellent sax player himself...

c'mon yanks, we need to win! esp. w/ haren on the bump manana...

oh, and FOX sucks. why isn't this game being televised. these silly 3:55 games and generally 1 game per saturday. there are no other conflicting games on right now. i don't have YES down here and would love to see our boyz. though i'd rather not see us get no-hit... : ~

2007-06-30 11:28:04
239.   Zack
Maybe I'll have a burrito...or fish taco...
2007-06-30 11:28:38
240.   standuptriple
And "hitting coach" Donnie is supposed to be the heir apparent? I'd like to see a larger successful sample size before he gets the keys. Of course, the Yanks hitters have always been resistent to altering their approach. I thought a solid reuptation guy like Mattingly would change that. I suppose that like asking a leopard to change its spots.
2007-06-30 11:28:51
241.   Zack
238 Don't mess with my mojo, hombre
2007-06-30 11:29:16
242.   Zack
Oh, well, the mojo is gone, broken by too many comments, so be it
2007-06-30 11:30:03
243.   Zack
See, that ball 4 would have been strike 3...
2007-06-30 11:31:19
244.   cult of basebaal
if something bad happens here ... you're all to blame for bustin' zack's magic mojo streak
2007-06-30 11:31:27
245.   standuptriple
238 I have the crappy local A's feed. No High Def for my AM. I'll get the Muts @ Phily later though (puke) and the Giants/Barry love fest at night. 4 teams I could get a rat's ass about in HD, but not this game. I love technology.
2007-06-30 11:32:15
246.   standuptriple
Bye-bye mojo.
2007-06-30 11:32:25
247.   Zack
Thats too balls now that would have been strikes had the mojo been going
2007-06-30 11:32:52
248.   standuptriple
So that's what a 1B is supposed to do?
2007-06-30 11:33:02
249.   Zack
Wow, as if proving our points, eh?
2007-06-30 11:33:04
250.   fansince77
Flahrety - you were saying...
Show/Hide Comments 251-300
2007-06-30 11:33:17
251.   cult of basebaal
for shame, people, for shame
2007-06-30 11:33:42
252.   Zack
You know, 4 runs in 6-7 innings would be pretty good for a #5 if we could score some DAMN RUNS
2007-06-30 11:34:21
253.   cult of basebaal
man, igawa sure gets tateritis bad, don't he ...
2007-06-30 11:35:27
254.   Zack
Shoot, might as well make Igawa go the long haul if the offense is going to be so DITW...No point in using the BP, Kei really hasn't been so bad (killed by the long ball yet again, but some promising signs in keeping the ball down)
2007-06-30 11:35:55
255.   Zack
This is all on standuptriple and thelarmis, obviously...
2007-06-30 11:36:37
256.   standuptriple
253 That's what happens when you have a BP fastball. That was nice the last one was hit 0-2...into the upper deck. Maybe he can pay the fine with that huge contract we gave him.
2007-06-30 11:38:09
257.   thelarmis
255 hey, what the hell did i do???
2007-06-30 11:38:52
258.   standuptriple
I love how there's not even a thread for today's game.
See ya no-no.
2007-06-30 11:39:22
259.   Zack
I wouldn't call 91-92 a bp fastball, and besides, I believe the HR was on a crappy slider. Igawa's problem now is a combo of having his retooled mechanics still liable to go out of whack leading to a very bad tendancy to leave balls up in the zone, and the fact that he really isn't all that good.

However, if he can continue to improve on his mechanics, I'll take 7 innings and 4 runs from our #5 every time out, that would place him as league average, which is actually better than a #5. Not that it will really happen...

2007-06-30 11:40:17
260.   thelarmis
hey, we got a hit!!!
2007-06-30 11:41:25
261.   thelarmis
4 runs for our lineup should not seem as insurmountable as it unfortunately does...
2007-06-30 11:41:58
262.   standuptriple
259 Yeah, that's the frustration talking. It's not BP. But it's not enough to leave it up in the zone, for sure. Hanging sliders often find the seats.
2007-06-30 11:42:01
263.   fansince77
damons gotta go here.
2007-06-30 11:42:21
264.   fansince77
sorry- jeter
2007-06-30 11:42:36
265.   standuptriple
2007-06-30 11:42:50
266.   cult of basebaal
igawa's stuff is ok ... especially for a lefty ... it's just not good enough to survive him making bad pitches and his bad pitches seem to get crushed ... i wonder if part of the problem is that given his sucess in japan, i bet he's used to getting a lot more of the borderline pitches called in his favor, whereas here, being just a rookie, he isn't
2007-06-30 11:42:56
267.   thelarmis
there's the boBBy we know and love. c'mon alex, make this a 1-run game!
2007-06-30 11:44:04
268.   cult of basebaal
once again, alex is asked to do the heavy lifting
2007-06-30 11:44:23
269.   Zack
262 Yeah, most definitely. Hanging sliders and 91 MPH staight fastballs up in the zone are not good. I still think that his "stuff" is good enough to succed if he can learn to pitch down in the zone, and he'll better be able to get away with those crap sliders that seem to happen about once an inning or so...
2007-06-30 11:45:09
270.   standuptriple
That was ball 4.
2007-06-30 11:45:11
271.   Zack
266 Beat me to it...
2007-06-30 11:45:54
272.   cult of basebaal
2007-06-30 11:45:58
273.   Zack
That was a ball to Kei...oh well
2007-06-30 11:46:15
274.   Zack
As Alex goes, so goes the yanks O
2007-06-30 11:46:26
275.   fansince77
three chances when you know what's coming? c'mon!
2007-06-30 11:46:35
276.   Zack
So, seriously, pitch Kei as long as you possible can, no?
2007-06-30 11:46:36
277.   thelarmis

cult - you get the email about the latin-jazz gig at the baked potato?

2007-06-30 11:46:52
278.   standuptriple
I hate Angel Hernandez more than any other ump in the game. Thanks for widening A-rod's zone, fuckstick.
2007-06-30 11:48:27
279.   cult of basebaal
sure ... then bring in MO ... after all, he's our late inning, down 4-0 specialist, no?
2007-06-30 11:48:28
280.   thelarmis
278 here-here! i can't stand him - worst ump i've ever seen. ever.
2007-06-30 11:49:26
281.   cult of basebaal
uh-oh! Krusher Kendall is up.
2007-06-30 11:50:07
282.   Zack
Uh oh, apparently, Gaudin has a BFOG...

Why, why are you bringing in Proctor Joe? Its 4-0!

2007-06-30 11:50:41
283.   Zack
I guess Joe just needs to get Proctor his 2+ innings to assure him of sucking when it matters...
2007-06-30 11:51:03
284.   cult of basebaal
282 yeah, that's Mo's job!
2007-06-30 11:51:07
285.   Zack
I mean, its not like Ron Villone isn't wasting away in crapatude in our pen and should pitch in games like this...
2007-06-30 11:51:31
286.   fansince77
I don't think Proctor has thrown enough innings this year...Imagine if he was ambidexterous?
2007-06-30 11:52:13
287.   cult of basebaal
thealarmis, hmmm, i didn't see it, when did you send? i might have deleted it by accident
2007-06-30 11:52:40
288.   standuptriple
Why, Torre, why? The Proctorologist?
280 Consistently. Umps are supposed to be invisible. He never is.
I think A-rod could have made some adjustments. They gave him nothing but outside pitches. Kendall, for all his hitting woes (as he goes 3-for-3...thanks Everyday), calls a good game.
2007-06-30 11:52:49
289.   cult of basebaal
285 or even, The Deuce, or Bruney
2007-06-30 11:53:04
290.   Zack
Sure is good we brought in Proctor to limit Kendell just to a single rather than a HR
2007-06-30 11:54:58
291.   standuptriple
Now's a good time to throw a beanball. Since today's game is over.
2007-06-30 11:55:25
292.   thelarmis
287 hmmm, that's weird - i sent it friday afternoon at 3:47pm east coast time, so you should've had it yesterday around 1pm. i can resend it right now if you'd like. i didn't get a failure notice or anything so i should have the correct email addy...

i would've left quest in. this is about to get ugly...

2007-06-30 11:55:48
293.   Zack
Great managing Joe, great pitching Proctor. Still no idea why Igawa couldn't be left in, but I suppose we need to put this game out of reach, as if it wasn't already
2007-06-30 11:56:23
294.   cult of basebaal
send again, i must have junked it by accident
2007-06-30 11:58:11
295.   cult of basebaal
temek at earthlink dot net
2007-06-30 11:58:50
296.   bobtaco
Proctor is awesome.
2007-06-30 11:59:19
297.   standuptriple
Nice walk of shame, Joe.
2007-06-30 11:59:36
298.   Zack
Awesome...this sucks, time to get to work
2007-06-30 11:59:46
299.   bobtaco
Maybe Joe will bring in Farns now?
2007-06-30 12:00:15
300.   cult of basebaal
what's the reaction in the stadium
Show/Hide Comments 301-350
2007-06-30 12:00:54
301.   thelarmis
294 i just resent the email. the subject title is Bronx Banter/Baked Potato, so look for that as you won't recognize my name... lemme know if it reaches you...

why am i not shocked it's now 6-0. this is awful. boston's offense has been pretty anemic lately, but they keep winning 1-run low scoring games. this is a really shitty season. : /

2007-06-30 12:01:34
302.   standuptriple
Let's see, who can Joe burn so they can't be used tomorrow when they really need him? Mo?
2007-06-30 12:01:45
303.   thelarmis
299 neh, this seems to be the perfect time to use Mo for 1+ innings... ; )
2007-06-30 12:02:13
304.   bobtaco
300 Lots of boos. Proctor just made Igawa look really good. If you take away that HR by Johnson (who should have been out on a called third strike that wasn't) Igawa pitched a decent game
2007-06-30 12:03:35
305.   thelarmis
cust hasn't homered yet today. here's his chance... : ~
2007-06-30 12:04:07
306.   cult of basebaal
got it! thanks, hopefully i'll be able to check it out ...
2007-06-30 12:04:08
307.   standuptriple
Hard to win games when you don't score any runs.
2007-06-30 12:04:26
308.   thelarmis
295 yeah man, i have the correct email addy, so hopefully this one makes it to you!
2007-06-30 12:05:29
309.   standuptriple
Nice sequence Meyers. Let's get another guy from the pen up. Maybe even 2.
2007-06-30 12:05:35
310.   bobtaco
Jesus. What a terrible game.
2007-06-30 12:05:43
311.   cult of basebaal
bullpen walks make the baby jesus cry ... then again, lots of things are keeping the baby jesus' tear ducts busy these day, what with the way this season is going ...
2007-06-30 12:05:47
312.   thelarmis
306 oh, good - rock on!

always a nice touch to bring a reliever in to walk somebody. handedness is sometimes overrated. this game sucks...

2007-06-30 12:06:14
313.   standuptriple
2007-06-30 12:07:17
314.   thelarmis
pile it on. how bout a 2-run single next? really great way to start the day. feh!
2007-06-30 12:07:33
315.   cult of basebaal
2007-06-30 12:07:46
316.   standuptriple
And I get to finish my night at a party filled with 15 year old girls. Just kill me now.
2007-06-30 12:08:25
317.   cult of basebaal
no,no,no. they're not boooing ... they're just yelling, The Deuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuce!
2007-06-30 12:08:25
318.   Yankees Brasil
Why even bother bringing Myers to face a LH batter...he never gets them out
2007-06-30 12:09:18
319.   thelarmis
316 i am NOT gonna touch that one.

i get to play a mellow(ish) jazz gig. kinda wishing it was a hard hitting metal gig at this point...

2007-06-30 12:09:29
320.   standuptriple
I always love a guy brought in to IBB load the bases.
2007-06-30 12:10:23
321.   standuptriple
319 Me neither. No touching...or even looking.
2007-06-30 12:10:33
322.   cult of basebaal
why ask why, my friend, just drink heavily until dizziness and loss of orientation occurs ...
2007-06-30 12:11:26
323.   fansince77
It would be great if everyone at the stadium went home right now and left the Yankees to finish the next two innings with the crowd they deserve...imagine that demanding a better effort by saying this isn't worth sitting through.
2007-06-30 12:12:41
324.   thelarmis
321 smart man!

and the inning finally ends. our dreams of the wild card are about to also...

viz best come back out for the 8th...

2007-06-30 12:14:29
325.   standuptriple
The wife just gave me a meanial task. Just what I need to get my eyes away from this train wreck of a game.
2007-06-30 12:14:33
326.   thelarmis
322 yes, beer is your friend! i'll be imbibing many ales after the gig tonite : )

or, as homer simpson would say: "Beer. the cause and solution to all of mans problems." how true!

2007-06-30 12:14:50
327.   cult of basebaal
is The Deuce now officially are most reliable reliever (non-Mo edition)? Isn't that actually one of the lesser known signs of Armeggeddon?
2007-06-30 12:16:49
328.   Zack
Why Torre thinks that the BP is more reliable than even Igawa at this point is quite confusing, but so are a lot of things...So now our pathetic lineup have made the O's and the A's awful ones look like, well, what ours was supposed to be...please, just do what you have to do to blow up this team, they are so unwatchable.
2007-06-30 12:17:21
329.   fansince77
prediction- weak ground ball to second base
2007-06-30 12:18:28
330.   cult of basebaal
And, Lo! I beheld a pale horse, upon it sat The Deuce ...
2007-06-30 12:18:47
331.   thelarmis
328 yeah, and i think the rockies have lost like 8 in a row since sweeping us... : ~
2007-06-30 12:19:10
332.   3rd gen yankee fan
323 Word. Fan protest.
2007-06-30 12:20:47
333.   thelarmis
1 measly hit in 7 innings. unbelievable.
2007-06-30 12:24:41
334.   thelarmis
and there's the leadoff walk i love so much! what a great pitching staff we have...
2007-06-30 12:25:05
335.   alterity
--For the Yankees no runs on one hit. . one hit? That's all we got was one g0dd@mn hit?

--You can't say g0dd@mn on the radio!

--Who cares, no ones listening.

At least not for much longer.

2007-06-30 12:25:30
336.   OldYanksFan
316 I hope the Yankees aren't driving you to a life of crime.
2007-06-30 12:27:20
337.   thelarmis
i know villone is rusty, but c'mon. and kendall is having a historically bad season. nothing like yankee pitching to turn him around...
2007-06-30 12:29:22
338.   standuptriple
336 Nope. Just insanity and self torture.
2007-06-30 12:31:01
339.   yankz
Follow the day and reach for the sun!
2007-06-30 12:31:12
340.   Yankee Fan in Chicago
Of the everday players, everyone not named Jorge, Derek, or Alex (and maybe Melky given his d and his June hitting) deserves to be sent for instructional work for 2 weeks in Tampa.

Ditto everyone not named Mo in the bullpen (and maybe Viz, who's been decent lately.)

Then we cobble together a bullpen and 5-6 position players from Scranton, Trenton, and Tampa. Shelley, Gardner, Tabata etc.

Let them play for 2 weeks. Embarass the BFOG vets.

Kids from the minors couldn't hit any worse, could they? And lord knows anyone is an improvement over Proctor et al these days.

2007-06-30 12:31:37
341.   OldYanksFan
Batting #3 .67 ABs .254 / .684 OPS
Batting #5 .50 ABs .240 / .785 OPS
Batting #6 120 ABs .308 / .875 OPS

Not a huge sample size, but 117 ABs at #3/#4 with an OPS of .725 +/- vs .875 at #6

Mean anything?

2007-06-30 12:32:25
342.   thelarmis
a reliever (well, converted starter for the moment...), coming out of the pen and throwing strikes? what a concept!
2007-06-30 12:33:06
343.   yankz
Who has the hit? I'm too depressed to look it up myself.
2007-06-30 12:33:16
344.   thelarmis
339 more like reach for the Sun Ra. preferably the more out, avant stuff...
2007-06-30 12:33:52
345.   yankz
Don't worry, Dan Cy Haren goes tomorrow.
2007-06-30 12:33:53
346.   thelarmis
343 damon. measly little single.

BFOB = belly full of beer. props to elton john of all people...

2007-06-30 12:34:55
347.   thelarmis
well, that was a very nice AB by AP! not that it'll matter in the long run...
2007-06-30 12:36:54
348.   thelarmis
now this is the kind of relief pitching i am used to!
2007-06-30 12:38:22
349.   Eirias
This is a debacle.
2007-06-30 12:38:32
350.   thelarmis
i'd love to see jetes develop a bit more power here in his 30's. at least we'd avoid being shutout...
Show/Hide Comments 351-400
2007-06-30 12:38:51
351.   cult of basebaal
339 more like ... follow the game and reach for a beer
2007-06-30 12:39:05
352.   thelarmis
ooh, thanks eirias - i usually don't begin talking to myself til after midnight! ; )
2007-06-30 12:43:39
353.   yankz
351 Or a steak knife.

Captain, Arod, and Posada get a pass. You're allowed to have off days.

Too bad the rest of the lineup is garbage. No one to pick up the slack when those days come.

2007-06-30 12:45:06
354.   thelarmis
ooh, i'll pitch the 9th!
2007-06-30 12:45:51
355.   Zack
It's like everyday we say that things couldn't possible get worse and that its the lowpoint of the season, and just to spite us, the Yanks go out and somehow prove us wrong...
2007-06-30 12:47:01
356.   Zack
Remember like an hour and a half ago yet only 2 innings ago when we were talking about how there was no reason to take Igawa out of the game and he should just pitch as long as he possibly could? Yeah, jsut checking...
2007-06-30 12:50:47
357.   yankz
You guys got recommendations on good Phish albums? I like 'em, but don't know enough about them. Thanks.
2007-06-30 12:56:04
358.   Zack
357 Unfortunately, by far their best stuff is all bootlegs/live, so you can go to a good record store and ask, do the "illegal" downloading thing, or somesuch. On the other hand, just to start with studio albums, I would go with Junta or Lawn Boy. They do have some pretty good live albums they put out, Slip Stich and Pass, and Hampton Comes Alive both are good...

Does that help?

2007-06-30 12:58:07
359.   yankz
358 Yeah, thanks. I'm thinking about picking up Rift and Junta.
2007-06-30 12:58:42
360.   yankz
This is insanely cool, especially the 2nd song:

Some NSFW language

2007-06-30 13:01:24
361.   cult of basebaal
357 hmmm ... that's actually tough ... i only own 3 of the studio albums ... and about 300 or 400 shows ... maybe i'd say start with A Picture of Nectar and Farmhouse and Slip, Stitch and Pass for an accessible live album ...
2007-06-30 13:01:35
362.   thelarmis
yankz --

my fave Phish album is called Rift. by far. it's easily their most polished and progressive effort, from a performance standpoint.

the album that preceeded it, was definitely foreshadowing the greatness that is Rift. this album is called A Picture of Nectar. (nectar, was the name of the owner of a club phish used to play in their home state of vermont, before they blew up and got huge).

the album after Rift - hoist - is their most slick sounding studio effort. great songs and they brought in some outside forces, like female background vocals and even the amazing Tower of Power horn section, for a coupla songs.

those are the 3 studio cd's i suggest. they're mainly known as a live band. the only official live record i have, is their 1st of this sort - A Live One. i like it a good bit, but i stopped following them after that.

i didn't mention the 1st 2 cds in their catalog. so, i suggest, in order: Rift, Nectar, Hoist...

hope that helps.

2007-06-30 13:03:37
363.   Bob Timmermann
I was surprised to discover that the Yankees were one-hit twice in 2006 and by the Orioles both times.

I forgot that Cabrera got to within two outs of a no-hitter.

2007-06-30 13:04:32
364.   weeping for brunnhilde

What is there left to say, really?

2007-06-30 13:05:32
365.   thelarmis
wow, 1 friggin hit. one. uno. ah, carp...

zack took care of the 1st 2 phish cd's...

cult has the live thing down...

i took care of the 'mid-era' studio cds...

yankz - you're all set, dude! maybe grab 1 from each era or something -- junta, rift and slip stich & pass for live. be aware, junta, their debut, is a 2cd set, so it may cost more...

2007-06-30 13:05:47
366.   cult of basebaal
well, you can also go to the phish site and download a whole crapload of shows in FLAC ... other live shows that i would recommend that you can get either from LivePhish or in the store:

2-28-2003 Nassau Coliseum
4-2-1998 the
4-3-1998 island
4-4-1998 tour
4-5-1998 shows
10-31-1996 "Remain in Light" Halloween

2007-06-30 13:08:00
367.   thelarmis
363 thanks bob, i feel better now : /

at least we won the damn division in 06.

we all liked Quest, the person, in the offseason. still, there really wasn't much of a need that we had to go out and sign him. it reeked of cashman trying to keep up with beantown's moves and i don't like working like that.

here's hopin' we somehow knock the beard off of ha(i)ren tomorrow...

2007-06-30 13:09:51
368.   thelarmis
366 was that halloween show at the omni in atlanta? it was either that year or 1997. i was front row and backstage, 'coz i was with Hampton at the time and he sat in for a performance art segment. other than that, that show was actually really boring, imho...
2007-06-30 13:10:46
369.   cult of basebaal
362 i'm not as big a fan of A Live One and the 94'/'95 era as i am of '97/'98. They found the funk during the time they were rehearsing to cover Remain in Light for Halloween '96 and it made them a far more interesting listen for me ... Slip Stitch and Pass is from the spring tour of Europe in '97 when the funk was starting to gel ...
2007-06-30 13:12:10
370.   rbj
One freakin' hit?!
Glad I spent the day out and about, even putting on the rollerblades.


2007-06-30 13:13:31
371.   Zack
My Phish knowledge tails off after slip stich, though this discussion has inspired me anew!
2007-06-30 13:14:57
372.   cult of basebaal
alright ... gotta run ... remember everyone, the immortal words of lionel hutz ... "sweet liquor, eases the pain ..."
2007-06-30 13:15:00
373.   yankz
Man, you all are awesome. Thanks a million.
2007-06-30 13:16:06
374.   thelarmis
369 oh, you totally know waaaaay more than i do about their live stuff. the guitarist in one of my many bands got slip stitch and pass and i remember it sounding great. i just had kinda switched gears around that time, musically, and didn't stick with them. i should definitely check out that live record again at some point.

i have fishman on a cool mandolin project cd... i'm not a big MM&W fan, but there was a bootleg w/ trey sitting in with them at a cool club in Austin, TX and that was a cool live tape.

i have Phish doing the White album on video and that was fun also. you and my best friend out in denver would have a blast talking all the live phish stuff...

2007-06-30 13:16:08
375.   weeping for brunnhilde
340 Speaking of instructional work, I heard Kay talking about how the team took infield practice today, and that the very idea of infield practice is a dying art.

I had no idea.

What the fuck is up with these players today?--practicing fundamentals is beneath them?

No wonder they all suck so bad, my God.

2007-06-30 13:17:38
376.   weeping for brunnhilde
350 Nooooooo!!! The last thing Derek needs is more power. He's fine the way he is, leave him be...
2007-06-30 13:19:13
377.   thelarmis
375 that's a good point weeping. i actually use tons of baseball analogies when i teach drum lessons. i'm always talking about the fundamentals (rudiments) and practicing and studying. i tell them how the best ballplayers in the world have coaches and practice - hitting/fielding - before each game. practice should NEVER be a dying art -- in any field...
2007-06-30 13:22:37
378.   thelarmis
376 ah, i hear ya -- i'm just gunning for him to eventually reach my favorite 300-300 club! i've written like 4 or 5 loooong research essays on it. if he can keep up about 15 hr's for the next 7-8 years or so, til he's 40, he'll be in...
2007-06-30 13:22:41
379.   weeping for brunnhilde
377 I know, it kills me. And I have heard that in music as well. The old jazz musicians talking about how the kids today can't be bothered to learn the fundamentals.

All it means is that one day someone will have to reinvent the wheel.

Someone should write a book, a serious book on the state of fundamentals in baseball today.

Or even just a general history of "fundamentals" in baseball.

I'd read such a book.

I really couldn't believe when Kay said how rare infield practice was. Like it was some quaint thing the team did.

Kind of disgusting, imo.

2007-06-30 13:23:50
380.   weeping for brunnhilde
378 Yeah, but his power has actually gone down the last couple of years, right? He used to hit like 19-23, but suddenly he dipped to like 13 one year, right?

Fine by me, so long as his average stays high.

2007-06-30 13:26:34
381.   thelarmis
379 pitch it to Harold Reynolds! ; )

yeah, it's true. a coupla years ago, i had a kid come to me 'coz he wanted to learn how to play Jazz drums. well, he wanted to be Elvin Jones right away and play along to 1960's John Coltrane records. yeesh. i had to start him at the very, very basics of jazz drumming which can be difficult, tedious, boring, etc. needless to say, the kid got frustrated quick and didn't last.

really though, what it comes down to, is no matter how talented someone is, there really are NO shortcuts. practice really does make perfect. or closer to it...

2007-06-30 13:29:40
382.   thelarmis
380 that's what i'm sayin' - his HR totals have indeed gone down. however, i do think he'll reach 15 this year and keep that up. he says he'll play another decade and he should make it in.

i hope biggio still gets enough AB's the rest of the season to try. i don't know that he'll be playing next season. he's averaged in the 20's the last 4 years but is stuck at a jeteresque 5 longballs right now. he needs like another 14 to make it to 300-300.

i really wish someone would've given rickey another comeback chance. would've been great for him to hit another 3 homers...

2007-06-30 13:32:50
383.   thelarmis
jeter's HR totals:

96 - 10
97 - 10
98 - 19
99 - 24
00 - 15
01 - 21
02 - 18
03 - 10 (injured)
04 - 23
05 - 19
06 - 14
07 - 5 (1/2 season)

total = 188

2007-06-30 13:34:47
384.   OldYanksFan
Is it too much to ask Abreu for one friggin' paradiddle? Won't even talk about a flamadiddle.
2007-06-30 13:40:13
385.   brockdc
357 Junta is great. And, as far as their studio albums, I've always been partial to "Billy Breathes." It's by far their most polished effort, IMO.
2007-06-30 13:40:46
386.   thelarmis
nice OYF! yeah, flamadiddles are actually kinda hard. even using prep strokes and moeller technique. single flammed mills are pretty much the same thing only better and easier!

boBBy was a cinch to join the 300-300 until his loss of power following that fateful homerun derby at comerica. say he hits 11 more this year, giving him 15 on the season and 220 for his career. he'll need to average 15 or so for the next 5+ seasons to reach the mark. at this point, who knows - not so likely...

2007-06-30 13:52:18
387.   weeping for brunnhilde
386 Did Abreu screw up his swing too in the HR derby? I know Mets people notice that David Wright hasn't been the same hitter since his HR derby.

If I were a manager, I'd absolutely forbid my players from participating in that circus act.

Hit the ball up the middle if you're such goddamned good hitters. That should be the contest--they should award the crown to the guy who hits the most linedrives up the middle.

384 What's a paradiddle? A dinger?

2007-06-30 14:02:40
388.   thelarmis
who knows if abreu truly screwed up his swing in the HR derby, but all signs surely do point it. it didn't affect ryan howard. maybe that's 'coz he's a true power hitter. who knows? but abreu certainly hasn't shown much power since then. and that's at the bandbox known as citizens bank and the short porch in da bronx.

neh, a Paradiddle is the most basic Drum rudiment there is. now that doesn't mean it's easy! it combines singles & doubles (no dingers!) and switches hands. it's a 4-note group (3 strokes if using proper technique!) - i'll spell it out for you using R's for right hand and L's for left hand; 1st note of each grouping should be played with an emphasis:

A Single Paradiddle:

2007-06-30 14:40:56
389.   weeping for brunnhilde
388 Ah, thanks!
2007-06-30 14:51:01
390.   JL25and3
Just back from the Stadium.

A lot of you probably thought that game sucked royally, but that's entirely wrong. It wasn't anywhere near that good. I'm not even sure it was baseball - whatever the Yankees were doing, it sure as hell wasn't playing baseball.

It might have been the single most boring game I've ever been to. The only Yankees who did anything at all interesting were Proctor and Myers - they were wretched, but at least it was slightly interesting. I could get pissed off, which was better than just watching...nothing. Not a single goddamn thing. I would have welcomed a no-hitter, because at least that's something.

Well, the weather was perfect, the best day imaginable. The company was good. We had a day in the sun, and somewhere below us guys in pinstripes were walking from the dugout to the plate and back again. Maybe next time I'll see baseball.

2007-06-30 15:00:53
391.   yankz
388 Oh, and I always forget to tell you, but IMO drums are the coolest things this side of Yankee Stadium. I could watch John Bonham videos all day. It's probably too late, but I hope to learn some day myself. Cliche alert, but keep rocking, man.
2007-06-30 15:01:17
392.   weeping for brunnhilde
390 Thanks for setting the record straight, JL. Sorry you had to witness such nothingness.

Are we exasperated yet?

Ooooh, goody, it just occurred to me that California's coming up soon, right?

You think today was bad?--You just wait 'til the Californias come to town.

2007-06-30 15:06:12
393.   yankz
392 Way past exasperated. Somewhere around "numb."
2007-06-30 15:07:26
394.   yankz
Could this replace 2004 as the most humiliating season?
2007-06-30 15:17:08
395.   JL25and3
394 2004? They made the ALCS that year, just lost it in embarrassing fashion. This year could rival 1966, when the Yankees became one of only six teams (post-1900) to finish in tenth place. Tenth!
2007-06-30 15:21:32
396.   yankz
395 I don't know; I think I might just rather miss the postseason than live through that hell again.
2007-06-30 15:23:00
397.   Mattpat11
Is this the new rock bottom?
2007-06-30 15:24:40
398.   thelarmis
i'm as pissed as everyone about how uninspiring this team is. buuuut, pete abe did have a good point the other day -- something like 8 games back in the wild card, 80+ games to play, just need to make up 1 game per week. i dunno, time is certainly running out, but i guess we still have somewhat of a slim chance...

391 rock on, yankz! i only have a second, 'coz i need to get motorin' and go play a gig w/ my jazz trio tonite, but - cliche alert: it's never too late to start! it's really true, bro. i've taught plenty of older folks who were either just starting 'coz they always wanted to play but never did or used to play when they were kids but life got in the way.

one thing i tell older students who are just starting, you may wanna keep in mind, and this is for any instrument -- since you're older, you may pick up stuff more quickly. so if there's something that might take a year for a 10 yr. old to learn, it might take an adult only a month. of course, there's no substitute for experience, like starting early, but you can make up more ground more quickly when you start later.

if you ever wanna start up, lemme know where you are in NY and i might be able to hook you up with a teacher or something.

and yeah, drums RULE!!! : )

2007-06-30 15:27:11
399.   randym77
375 They explained why no one does infield practice any more. When they did it, it was for the benefit of the scouts, not the players.

They said it's very hard on the players, having to loosen up their arms, cool down, then crank it up again for the game.

2007-06-30 15:49:53
400.   JL25and3
396 Be careful what you wish for. There's a big difference between merely not making the playoffs and watching a truly wretched team. I don't know if you remember 1991, but it wasn't pretty.
Show/Hide Comments 401-450
2007-06-30 16:14:19
401.   weeping for brunnhilde
399 Yeah, I did hear that, but it didn't make any sense to me.

Teams conducted infield practice for the benefit of scouts, not to keep their players sharp?

I don't know, it's hard to believe there aren't drills they could do that aren't so taxing on their precious arms. If they can do bp, they can do other kinds of drills, I'd think.

But whatever. It's a new day.

2007-06-30 16:18:25
402.   yankz
401 We play today, we get humiliated today.

(If you haven't noticed, I've been saying that a lot lately.)

2007-06-30 16:23:07
403.   BklynBmr
398 Thanks for a timely (albeit pinstripe unrelated) post for me. My 16 year old son is ripping it up on the guitar, 90% self taught, with a little help from a pro lately. Dude can shred. He started about 18 months ago, and it's blown me away how quickly he's picked this up — can't be from me (a tone deaf, frustrated bassist, so probably from my wife, exceptional on the piano, great voice.)

My son has been bugging/inspiring me to attack the bass again and your words where just what I needed to hear ;-) When I was coming up, Jaco Pastorius and Stanley Clarke were my boys, but never committed the time required to learn those chops. One my greatest regrets.

So thanks for the inspiration — this will be the perfect distraction over the summer while we climb back into the wild card chase ;-)

And... I caught most of today's loss on the tube, the rest in the car radio (local feed from Oaktown), and I can't recall a more lifeless effort this season. I'm sure there was one lately which I've blotted out of my mind, but damn, this squad needs a kick in the ass big time. Except for Cap, A-God, and Jorgie, of course...

2007-06-30 16:36:31
404.   ny2
apparently the captain is bothered by right knee tendinitis

2007-06-30 16:42:39
405.   cult of basebaal
you should check out the japanese leagues, weeping, you'd love the way they play the game ... and practice it ... and practice it ... and practice it ...


2007-06-30 16:43:23
406.   cult of basebaal
2007-06-30 17:24:27
407.   monkeypants
Missed todays game (two in a row--and you know what, the air smells sweeter, the sun shines warmer, etc.).

179 et al--Thanks for recapping the Farnsworth meltdown.

398 The problem is, making up a game a week, every week, for the rest of the season--without ever losing ground, against multiple teams, w/o many head-to-head games--is very difficult. It doesn't seem as daunting as it is, and tempts teams to make crazy trades, etc because they feel that they are still in it. I would rather the organization just accept that the season is probably lost, and just pull the plug and build for next year. Maybe they can get lucky and dump a reliever or OF for some prospects.

2007-06-30 17:27:54
408.   cult of basebaal
from what i've heard, cashman's been pretty frank that he's adamant about not trading the best of the pitching prospects for help ... the fact that we've sprung leaks in so many areas is probably a good thing, since even with being open to trading the best prospects, there's not enough to go around
2007-06-30 18:01:29
409.   Vandelay Industries

I still think we can get something for Farnsworth. Teams are always willing to take a chance on a guy who throws 98 MPH. Let that team try and "fix" him. We need some kind of pop off the bench. I think Cashman can get Barrett from the Padres, and we wont be burdened by his contract next season. Maybe the Padres won't part with Bard, but if they are looking to make a push in the NL, there is no reason for them to carry both Catchers in the light hitting NL West. They need all the pitching they can get. Move Jorge to 1B for the remainder of the season. Poof! 1B problem solved.

Maybe then they'll call up Ramirez. Wait, that makes too much sense.

2007-06-30 18:08:44
410.   Jen
I have an extra bleacher seat for tomorrow's game.

Email me: jen AT nosenseworrying DOT com

2007-06-30 18:30:30
411.   cult of basebaal
409 you mean the same san diego bullpen that has allowed the fewest inherited runners to score in the NL this year? The same pen that leads the NL in WRXL?

i'd like to have either of the SD catchers, i just don't see them needing farnsworth so badly that they'd be willing to deal from a position of weakness to bolster an area of strength ... especially since trading one of their two catchers leaves them without a capable backup and there's nothing we can give them to change that

2007-06-30 18:40:13
412.   cult of basebaal
not that farnsworth doesn't have any value, especially if we're willing to pick up most of his contract, even for next year ... i just think we'd be better off dealing with one of the teams really in need of bullpen help, that hopefully are also not the brightest bulbs in the socket (i'm looking at you, cincy ...)
2007-06-30 18:42:37
413.   Vandelay Industries

Just throwing it out there as a possibility. I know the Reds would love to have him. Their bullpen has been horrid, and even Farny can get NL hitters out. They have Votto in the wings, but Hatteberg is useless. Can you say Adam Dunn? Yes, we need someone in the lineup who can hit a HR other than Arod. Give up one prospect and Farny for Dunn. The Reds are going to deal him at some point anyway.

2007-06-30 18:43:08
414.   Vandelay Industries

You beat me to it.

2007-06-30 18:45:02
415.   Vandelay Industries
Unless they would deal Votto, but I strongly doubt that. His value has been down recently, but I dont think they'll move him.



and .... done!

2007-06-30 18:46:25
416.   Vandelay Industries
Kenny Lofton is killing the Red Sox...yes...I....said....Kenny (gulp) Lofton.
2007-06-30 18:49:18
417.   cult of basebaal
problem with dunn is that that the reds are currently asking a lot for him ... (which is ironic, since they don't seem to value him much) ... nobody's biting, 'cause they think his price will come down, which it will, but probably not until much closer to the deadline ... at which point, if we continue to play like this for another 3 weeks or so, i doubt there's going to be a point in making any trades for this year ... so i'd rather get something that might be useful down the road ...
2007-06-30 18:55:03
418.   Vandelay Industries
I hear you, especially considering that they may send Junior back to Seattle at some point.

It would be nice, but what does Brian Cashman care about a bench, what with Interleague and all.

2007-06-30 19:05:03
419.   monkeypants
413 417 Right--Dunn only makes sense if they envision him a piece of the puzzle down the line. I certainly would not give up a prospect for Dunn if they are just renting him for the next 80 games or so. Rather, I think they shoul forget about making deals to help this year and focus on next year.

I would rather they call up Shelley Duncan, put Damon on the DL (or put him down--really, it's not humane to let him suffer), and commit myself to 250 ABs for Duncan and Phillips at 1B and DH (with some BUIF for Phillips and some RF for Duncan).

Will they succeed? Probably not--especially in Phillips case. But who knows, maybe one of them makes the adjustment and you find a Shane Spencer or Marcus Thames (these type of players do have some value).

In any case, that would be a better use of the remaining season than adding spare parts to win only a few more games.

2007-06-30 19:08:49
420.   cult of basebaal
i sure do hope we see edwar soon, i haven't seen his change in action and i just looooove a really good changeup ... hopefully, if we trade away enough of joe's shiny but crappy BRoG guys, we'll actually get to see some of the next generation of good yankee pitching this year
2007-06-30 19:09:00
421.   weeping for brunnhilde
405 Thanks, cob! I'd love to. Damn it, there ought to be a baseball channel where you can watch baseball from Asia, Latin America, and wherever else they have organized games. What a treat that would be, especially during the off-season.

Plus, it would help continue the work begun by the World Baseball Classic (a wonderful invention).

Plus, if I watched enough Japanese baseball (my impression is that there's a lot of slap-hitting?), perhaps I'd come to develop a greater appreciation of major league swing-for-the-fences-every-time-up ball.


2007-06-30 19:09:03
422.   cult of basebaal
err, that's BFoG guys ...
2007-06-30 19:15:18
423.   cult of basebaal
421 you should read You Gotta Have Wa, by robert whiting ... it's a bit dated now (pre-dates ichiro!) but it's fascinating

i saw the semi-final game between South Korea and Japan last year down in Petco ... it was an amazing experience ... half the stadium was wearing korean white ... there was a rain delay late in the game ... a lot of the non-affiliated (that is, american) fans went home and the koreans all moved into the seats down the first base line and started chanting and singing, banging blue and white rally sticks together ... and kept it up for like 45 minutes straight ... a real special experience ...

having read whiting's book ... one of the things i've got on my list is to attend a japanese baseball game, sounds totally different than the american experience ... maybe even go check out the big HS baseball championship they have every year ... bigger than march madness over there ... frickin' country comes to a halt to watch ...

2007-06-30 19:19:21
424.   Vandelay Industries

I agree. Damon is a total loss. Glad Cashman saved some money by not signing Beltran. Beltran is having a bad year, but still heads above Damon, and he actually is a CF'er. What's worse is he doesn't want to go on the DL. Even worse, is that he is lobbying to get back in CF. I mean seriously, Damon should have played his last game in CF 5 years ago. He needs to get his head out of his ass and do what is best for the team, shut the fuck up and get healthy. Not being on the DL is not a streak for gods sake. Luck does not a streak make.

2007-06-30 19:23:36
425.   weeping for brunnhilde
423 Sounds a lot like soccer. I was in Rome last summer when Italy won the Cup. It was an amazing surge of public-spiritedness and public celebration (which was exhilarating) as well as strong nationalism. Not so exhilarating, but rather quite ominous. The parades of cars and scooters screaming their revelry and waving their flags through the streets of Rome recalled nothing so much as fascist mass hysteria.

But I suppose that's one of the functions of sports--take out your tribal hostilities in a safe, ritualized setting rather than on a battlefield.

Those rally sticks you mention...that must have just been unreal. The sound of tribal bloodlust...


2007-06-30 19:26:09
426.   monkeypants
424 The Beltran non-deal is irrelevant--water under the bridge. (Anyway, we'll see how good that deal looks in two or three years). Forget past decisions and look to next year.

As for Damon, I expect that athletes are not always the, er, most forward thinking fellows. I actually don't mind that he wants to be out there and 'help' the team, even though he's hurt. In many ways, he's the anti-Pavano.

No, the blame here falls on Cashman and/or Torre--whoever is really responsible for deciding to put players on the DL.

2007-06-30 19:29:27
427.   monkeypants
425 "But I suppose that's one of the functions of sports--take out your tribal hostilities in a safe, ritualized setting rather than on a battlefield."

Or to whip up tribal hostility and blood lust, so it can be channeled to the battlefield (or other less overtly destructive but equally ugly forums). I hate "national" sports, but I've ranted about that before.

2007-06-30 19:31:20
428.   cult of basebaal
424 you've really got it in for damon, man ... cut him some slack ... the DL thing, in the end, falls on cashman and torre ... as for cf, he was, overall, an average CF last year, and that includes the fact that he's got the worst CF out there ... this year, he's been bad, but he's also been nicked up since day 1

he had a good year with the bat last year, this year's been a loss to injury ... to write him off as a total loss seems premature ... in any case, there's no point in trading him when his value is at it's lowest ...

but we're in agreement that he should be on the DL, trying to get healthy ... hell, i argued the should have DL'd him right before they went on the road to Colorado

2007-06-30 19:34:06
429.   cult of basebaal
i dunno, the overall atmosphere was far more polite and intelligent than being in attendance for your average yankees - red sox game

no fights, no chanted obscenities, nobody got doused with beer for wearing the other team's shirt ...

2007-06-30 19:35:24
430.   cult of basebaal
428 that should be the worst CF arm out there ...
2007-06-30 19:45:07
431.   cult of basebaal
from river ave blues regarding today's games:

Alan Horne: 7 IP, 6 H, 1 R, 1 ER, 3 BB, 8 K - 106 K puts him only 9 behind Clay Buchholz for the Eastern League lead

I can't remember the last time i was so excited about actual (and i mean actual, not NY media hype) yankees pitching prospects

maybe never? i mean brien taylor, sure, but that lasted 1 season before he got hurt and the yankees were a godawful mess at that point

starting the end of this year, we're gonna start seeing some actual, live hard-throwing, good-pitching prospects start coming into the bronx ... and i'm gonna love it

2007-06-30 20:22:57
432.   weeping for brunnhilde
427 Agreed.

429 I guess I'm not surprised by that.

431 When you put it that way, cob, it sounds pretty awesome. Can't wait.

2007-06-30 20:30:42
433.   cult of basebaal
guess scotty p's getting as pissed as we are:


His temper already smoldering, Scott Proctor set off an inferno near the Yankee Stadium infield following Saturday's 7-0 loss to the A's, torching various items of his equipment in a smoky blaze.

Perhaps the hot-tempered Proctor hoped to excise some of his recent struggles, lighting a small bonfire a few feet from the top step of the Yankees dugout. He then watched from the railing for several minutes as the contents grew charred and unrecognizable.

..."I'm just throwing like [junk]," Proctor said after the game in an expletive-laced rant. "I can't expect to throw the ball over the middle and expect to get an out of it."

2007-06-30 21:07:16
434.   Raf
421 You'll have to settle for youtube for now. You can find winter league baseball (Mexico, Venezuela, Dominican Republic) on a Fox Sports affiliate. Don't know about baseball from Asia, I would think you could find a game on the tube somewhere around here, given all the ex-pats
2007-06-30 22:24:52
435.   thelarmis
OT reply to BrklynBomber 403, real late as i'm just getting home from my gig. not sure if you'll see this, but...

VERY cool that your son is killin' it on the guitar and you're very lucky to have a musical wife! the girl musician has alas been my downfall...

anyway, super glad if i was able to inspire you to pick up your axe again this summer! : ) bass is the coolest and it's the most important to me on a gig. i don't care about the bandleader or soloist - if the bass player isn't a top notch ryhthm section player, i'm miserable. we had a sub bass player in our trio tonite, but fortunately he's a fantastic upright player so all was well!

jaco and stanley clarke are great! you should check out rocco from early tower of power too. he's not a soloist though. gary willis and dominique de piazza are slammin' nowadays as is oteil burbridge.

if you're up in NYC, you need to try and check out matt garrison, fima emphron and ricard bona...

2007-06-30 23:06:49
436.   brockdc
419, 420 I haven't seen Duncan or Edwar play, but they are both putting up pretty gaudy numbers in the minors (especially Ramirez) right now. They're also both receiving a lot of pub - and rightfully so - on the Yankee blog circuit. Thing is, I wonder if they're even on Cashman's radar right now.

I read somewhere recently that Nardi Contreras thinks that Edwar is still a work in progress, that he needs work on locating his fastball - even though his ERA is sub-1. Jeez. Talk about not grading on a curve. Wonder what good things Nardi would have to say about Farns or Proc.

2007-06-30 23:22:31
437.   tommyl
Rumor is Ramirez might be getting called up (via Pending Pinstripes). No idea if its true or who is being sent down/traded/DFAed or DLed.
2007-06-30 23:27:55
438.   yankz
435 Thanks for all the music help today. I'm sure you're still awake to read this. Good god it's late.
2007-06-30 23:37:08
439.   Zack
437 Great news if true, though I think everyone needs to temper their expectations a bit. No idea why Britton is below Ramirez on the depth chart either.

I imagine Basak would be sent down, as he is useless as is, and someone like Colter Bean DFA'd...

2007-07-01 01:42:00
440.   thelarmis
438 of course i'm up, yankz! it's only 4:42am!!! ah, i'll sleep from 5-1, get my 8 hours, and follow our pinstriped heros get crushed by the bearded ha(i)ren.

i always tell people i work the other 9-5 : )

2007-07-01 01:46:30
441.   Vandelay Industries

I hope the kid gets a shot. But then again we have Villone and Farnsworth, why would we need Britton and Ramirez?

Brian and Joe just seem content to keep kicking the same dead horse all season.


I guess my gripe with Damon now is that he is stirring about moving back to Center, when he should be volunteering to move to 1B, and Cashman should be looking for someone to fill the DH spot until and if Giambi comes back. He should also be offering to platoon with Matsui and Abreu once or twice a week to give them a breather. Like I said earlier, someone did JD a large disservice when they allowed him to play CF in the first place. Whether it was in high school, little leage, or whenever. He never should have stepped foot out there.

2007-07-01 05:02:23
442.   joejoejoe
I missed the game and I'm catching up....did the Yanks get 1-hit by Charles Grodin?
2007-07-01 07:14:51
443.   weeping for brunnhilde
Ah, my dear joejoejoe. At this point in the season, don't tell me this in any way surprises you.

Charles Grodin.


2007-07-01 08:15:44
444.   yankz
I really had a dream that Johnny Damon's OPS+ was over 160.
2007-07-01 08:31:42
445.   yankz
Why the hell are Ron Villone and his 5 K in 14 IP (compared to 6 BB) on the team?
2007-07-01 09:10:03
446.   tommyl
444 You dream about OPS+? I'm a theoretical physicist and I'll even admit that's kinda sad ;).

What are your nightmares about? defensive metrics?

2007-07-01 09:15:59
447.   yankz
446 See 445

Kidding...I usually don't remember my dreams.

2007-07-01 09:44:23
448.   yankz
HA! Cano in the 3 hole!
2007-07-01 09:46:45
449.   Zack
Yup, Ramirez up, Basak finally out, Karstens moved to the 60 man (didn't see that one coming, but no biggie). Pete Abe reports it but acts liek he has no idea who the guy is, and talks about how "undere the radar" he is. It really bugs me when reporters do stuff like that. They can't be bothered to learn about the Yanks minor leaguers, and then act as if these guys are obviously not important etc, especially if they didn't know about them. How long does it take a beat reporter to click on a blog or scroll through minor league scoreboards? Its not like people haven't been mentioning his name like everyday...

Sorry, rant over. In any case, wanna put money on Torre bringing Ramirez in today? Its his way. And thenm, depending on his determination of his BFoG, he will either pitch in the next two games or not be seen again...

2007-07-01 09:47:06
450.   Jim Dean
448 Looks like Torre's been reading the Banter.

If so: It's time to retire - Geezer!

Show/Hide Comments 451-500
2007-07-01 09:55:40
451.   williamnyy23
I like the Ramirez promotion, but what has Chris Britton done (besides pitch well) to not deserve one as well?
2007-07-01 09:56:59
452.   Zack
451 Exactlly. There really is no reaason to call up Ramirez BEFORE Britton, who has a track record. Clearly Joe doesn't like fat guys or something, because there is no excuse, none at all, for havinghim wasting away in the minors, where he ain't learning anything, while Villone rots in the BP and can't even do that well...
2007-07-01 09:58:42
453.   yankz
450 Haha! Joe: I hate to say it, but Jimmy D's got this one right.

449 He also suggests that Ramirez is lying about his age (based solely on one picture), which to me is a pretty bold claim to make.

I pretty much expect the Yankees to get blown out today vs. Dan Haren, so we might actually get to see Edwar in action.

2007-07-01 09:59:47
454.   tommyl
449 Yes, I was annoyed at PeteAbe's comments as well. Guess without Josh Phelps around he needed a new whipping boy, sigh.

I predict that whenever he is actually brought in, he'll walk someone and Pete will have a comment that goes: See statheads, that's why he's a career minor leaguer. Major League players throw strikes with their fastball.

Of course, none of our actual big league relievers do that, but hey, that doesn't sound as good.

2007-07-01 09:59:50
455.   OldYanksFan
413 "..but Hatteberg is useless"
The guy was never great, but with Boston he was solid, and was decent for the A's?

Has he gone downhill that much?
He can't catch at all? Not better then Nieves?
And howabout Farns to Baltimore? Reunite him will Malzone?

2007-07-01 10:03:14
456.   tommyl
I have this pet theory that they are waiting to call Britton up once they trade Farnsworth. Its a pipe dream, but I'm sticking to it.

Poor kid, he pitches well in Baltimore, gets traded to the Yankees (yay! a non-crappy contender) only to find out they are a crappy non-contender and then gets sent down to AAA.

2007-07-01 10:08:05
457.   williamnyy23
I hate to revisit a point made in Colorado, but the Yankees continue to trot out a lineup with 5 below average hitters, so it shouldn't be a suprise that this team can't score. During the winning streak, guys like Abreu and Cano were chipping in, but now that they have returned to their slumber, we are seeing a manifestation of Giambi's absence. Unless something changes, this looks like a lineup that will blow hot and cold (mostly cold) based on the contribution of its underbelly.
2007-07-01 10:08:31
458.   Zack
Until Joe is gone, small moves like this to the BP aren't going to make alick of difference. Even DFAing Villone and Myers (dear God why hasn't this happened yet!) wouldn't force him to use kids. He'd just go to the "big three" mentality, and pitch Proctor even more (anyone else notice that he seems to be sitting around 91 now and never gets above 93?). I think before Cashman starts tearing things up Joe has to go, even if I like the guy and all...
2007-07-01 10:09:07
459.   williamnyy23
456 That's very funny in a sad, ironic, pathetic kind of way.
2007-07-01 10:09:35
460.   monkeypants
452 etc. Ramirz at best is just a first baby step. At least he has some potential value, replacing a "position" player who did nothing more than rot on the bench (come to think of it, that is one of the few positions that Torre IS patient with).

Now they need to DFA at least one other useless RP and replace him with a position play, preferrably someone with a little pop (or at least the potential of some power).

But this is still all window dressing--there need to be wholesale roster changes as this team (hopefully) pulls the plug on the season and begins building for next year and beyond.

2007-07-01 10:10:31
461.   Zack
One of two things will happens today: Another 1 hitter, or we blow out the A's and everyone (not us) declars that this is the game that (maybe) is the slump breaker yadda yadda yadda....
2007-07-01 10:11:05
462.   monkeypants
457 True. True. True.

But hey, there's enough offense to carry weak bats, right?

2007-07-01 10:12:06
463.   Zack
How long until all of the suits and tourists who go to Yanks game to be seen etc, stop showing up?
2007-07-01 10:14:43
464.   Zack
Gonna be a long day...
2007-07-01 10:21:09
465.   williamnyy23
It's amazing how Abreu continues to show minimal effort. Sometimes reputations are well deserved and stats do not tell the whole story. Abreu may very well be one such example.
2007-07-01 10:25:29
466.   Zack
Today is going to be just crappy. I was going to go down to Mexico for the day but my companions all bailed (something about July 4th weekend traffic being bad..lame excuse, as the traffic is ALWAYS bad), so now I am stuck with nothing to do but watch this crap game and do work, which I really don't want to do as its Sunday...
2007-07-01 10:27:19
467.   monkeypants
Maybe the Yankees should petition the league so they can just start the game with one out. The Damon could rest for an additional AB, and the results really wouldn't be much different.
2007-07-01 10:27:24
468.   OldYanksFan
Are we shopping a CF'er in the offseason?
If so, and if we get some power (A. Jones... but I don't want him), we can stand JD on 1B.
If we get Ichiro, who should lead off, JD becomes redundant, and we will need to find power at 1B.

JD's value to us really depends on who we get in the offseason.
He still has trade value, if we eat $5m or so.

2007-07-01 10:28:33
469.   OldYanksFan
Does anyone know if JD has a No-Trade clause?
2007-07-01 10:28:51
470.   williamnyy23
Do they have to play the rest of this game? I don't think the team could have a more lethargic first inning, which looks even worse coming on the heels of Posada's "going through the motions" comments.
2007-07-01 10:29:30
471.   51cq24
458 i think torre should be fired as much as anyone else. but let's be fair. what kids have been sitting in the bullpen unused when they should have been used? it's not like anyone has shown that he's a great reliever and should be the new 8th inning guy. i thought bruney could at the beginning of the year but then he proved me wrong when used more. the closest one is henn, but it's not like he was so great that it was a crime not to use him. the crime is using myers and villone. but if there were someone clearly good, i do think joe would use him. that is, if it's an obvious enough upgrade.
2007-07-01 10:30:32
472.   Zack
OYF, I think a lot of what the Yanks do in the offseason with the outfield depends on how Tabata and Action jackson finish up the year. If they continue as they are, they'll be in AA by years end, and AAA by mid next year (this is all purely best case), in which case a long term CF would be not the best move. Plus, with Gardner/Melky, they might just try that platoon...

Of course, none of that is really true, just what should be true. I imagine they will sit pat with Melky/Damon, hoping Damon recovers in the offeason. They'll need a RF too...

2007-07-01 10:31:52
473.   Zack
471 Britton, when hes been up...Henn...
2007-07-01 10:33:20
474.   Zack
Flaherty showing Kay up by mentioning that 6+ 4 R is, in fact, not a bad start.

meanwhile, do we have to watch this?

2007-07-01 10:35:00
475.   Bob Timmermann
From my perspective, it's the one game this morning that Extra Innings is showing in HD. And now I'm the kind of person who will watch a bad game that looks good on TV rather than a good game.
2007-07-01 10:35:10
476.   51cq24
473 yeah but he hasn't really been up long enough to know. i think it's probably true, but let's see if edwar is as good as his minor league numbers show before we complain about him not being used enough.

michael kay has to shut up about igawa running. what is his problem with it? fat people don't like when people run.

2007-07-01 10:37:52
477.   51cq24
474 flaherty has shown kay up quite a bit this season. my favorite is when kay starts talking about flaherty's career like he was some great player and flaherty says something like "i was just a light hitting catcher." like the other day when kay said something like "i don't know if it's ever happened to you, but it must be disheartening when someone is intentionally walked before you," and flaherty said "yeah of course it's happened to me." flaherty is a very good announcer.
2007-07-01 10:39:44
478.   Bob Timmermann
That ball carried surprisingly well.
2007-07-01 10:40:38
479.   OldYanksFan
472 We NEED an OFer, and could use 2. Regardless of the farm, I don't think they can 'wait' until a kid is ready.

Truth is in 2 years, we will need/have a whole new OF. Mats at 1B might be a way to improve the OF defense and still have a (hopefully) .800 OPS from first.

Mats is terrible at going back, and now is afraid to dive 'in'. I like the guy, but I consider him slightly (at least) below average on D.

An OF of Ichiro, Melky, Damon/Abreu/X with Mats on first seems decent.

The FA market next year on 1B seems thin. Not that many tasty OF'ers either.

Well.... Game over.
I guess THIS is the shortest game of the year.

2007-07-01 10:42:34
480.   WeMissPaulie
Is Pettitte even trying? Is anyone even trying?
2007-07-01 10:42:48
481.   JeremyM
On the bright side, Ramirez should get to pitch!

I guess Andy was tired of the offense not scoring for him, or the pen losing games and decided to do it himself. If Torre can survive this weekend, he is truly the Teflon Don (not saying I blame it all on him).

2007-07-01 10:43:11
482.   51cq24
474 no, we do not have to watch this. and i am going to stop.

when i was setting my fantasy lineup i was trying to decide whether to pitch haren. it's a head to head league and my pitching numbers are all leading my opponent's. he doesn't have any pitchers going, but if haren pitched poorly i could lose some of the numbers. the only thing that could help me is if he pitches a shutout. i really thought about pitching him. in the end i didn't because it was too much of a risk. but maybe it was a mistake.

2007-07-01 10:43:51
483.   Bob Timmermann
At this rate, Wil Nieves is going to pitch.
2007-07-01 10:43:57
484.   WeMissPaulie
This sucks.
2007-07-01 10:44:09
485.   monkeypants
Did Proctor set Pettitte's arm on fire yesterday?
2007-07-01 10:44:45
486.   monkeypants
483 If he's any good, then he might actually have value.
2007-07-01 10:44:56
487.   JeremyM
Oh wow, this stinks. Which position player gets to pitch now?
2007-07-01 10:45:50
488.   OldYanksFan
Wow... now Andy's ERA is in the toilet. Really... this year is hard to believe. I was there for 1965 and 1966. I simply can't believe this team is this bad.

This is just hard for me to believe.

2007-07-01 10:46:18
489.   WeMissPaulie
Honestly, if I were Torre, I'd pull up as many AAA players as I could and play them. As least we'd get to see who can play before Spring Training next year....
2007-07-01 10:46:35
490.   williamnyy23
Memo to Cashman...start preparing for 2008.
2007-07-01 10:47:33
491.   OldYanksFan
Possibly Andy did that to make Kei feel better?
2007-07-01 10:49:51
492.   williamnyy23
488 I don't think it is that hard to believe. As early as mid-April, I had strong feelings that this team was not going to fire. If you objectively look at the roster as well as who is at the helm, then I don't think you can really call this season a total shock.
2007-07-01 10:50:05
493.   monkeypants
489 No, if you were Torre you would let AAA players rot on teh bench while trotting Damon and company out there to flail away.

But I like YOUR plan better. Maybe Cashman is reading,

2007-07-01 10:51:34
494.   williamnyy23
I would have liked to see Posada get a standing was about time that someone took the team to task and put the onus for the team's poor effort back on Torre.
2007-07-01 10:52:27
495.   OldYanksFan
Matsui missed that by more then a foot.
2007-07-01 10:53:18
496.   Bob Timmermann
Pettitte's early knockouts in his career.

There haven't been many.

2007-07-01 10:53:52
497.   WeMissPaulie
Let me guess....Matsui into a DP?
2007-07-01 10:54:09
498.   WeMissPaulie
2007-07-01 10:55:59
499.   OldYanksFan
What did Jorge say/do? Any Links to it?
Abreu just POUNDING the ball.
2007-07-01 10:56:14
500.   williamnyy23
Abreu looks like he is going to be the summer's whipping boy...and deservedly so. Cashman would be wise to get him out of here as soon as possible.
Show/Hide Comments 501-550
2007-07-01 10:56:43
501.   williamnyy23
499 He pretty much said the team isn't giving a full effort.
2007-07-01 10:57:19
502.   Alvaro Espinoza
Andy just missed 2 meatballs.
2007-07-01 10:58:13
503.   Jim Dean
Anyone else see that the Attorney General got sent down to Trenton?

Kennedy with 4 K through 2 IP.

2007-07-01 10:59:06
504.   Alvaro Espinoza
3rd times the charm!

If you're Haren, why throw a breaking ball? Andy couldn't catch up to the first 2 fastballs.

2007-07-01 10:59:53
505.   51cq24
492 if you objectively look at the roster, you don't think it's surprising? that's pretty silly.

494 it sounded like there was a good amount of applause, but i couldn't really tell.

2007-07-01 11:00:09
506.   Jim Dean
P.s Damon's no-trade is the 26 million owed to him over the next two years.
2007-07-01 11:00:38
507.   monkeypants
502 But delivered with a hit.
2007-07-01 11:02:56
508.   williamnyy23
505 Is there a bench? A reliever outside of Rivera who can throw strikes? Any right handed power aside from Arod? A fifth starter? An even close to league average 1B?

With question marks like those, a .500 team is not a stretch.

2007-07-01 11:04:09
509.   WeMissPaulie
This game is going to trash our BP, more than it already is.
2007-07-01 11:04:27
510.   ny2
499 here's posada's direct quote:

"I'm not talking about unlucky," Posada said. "I just think luck comes when you go after it. It seems like, at times, we just go through the motions. Today is one of those cases. That's the way it is. I think everybody knows what I'm talking about."

2007-07-01 11:09:09
511.   cult of basebaal
wow! what a wonderful game to wake up to!
2007-07-01 11:10:35
512.   standuptriple
Did Proctor really burn all his equipment after yesterday's game?
2007-07-01 11:10:40
513.   cult of basebaal
504 but andy phillips can't hit breaking balls, just ask mattpatt ...
2007-07-01 11:10:53
514.   51cq24
508 is there a big difference between this team and the one that won 97 games last year? obviously you just named the problem areas, although i don't think the right handed power thing is that big a deal. but on paper, how many teams have a better starting rotation? how many teams have a better lineup? .500 is a stretch. let's not pretend we knew this was coming.
2007-07-01 11:13:17
515.   Jim Dean
Can they fire Sterling too? Please? Pretty please?

512 Yup. I love it. I think someone should set fire to the bat rack and the bullpen and especially Torre's office.

2007-07-01 11:16:12
516.   monkeypants
508 514 William exaggerates, I think, but the warning signs have been there for a couple of years for a serious decline in performance. The constant reliance on older, injury prone players--combined with little or no bench strength--set this season up. The degree of collapse has been a surprise.
2007-07-01 11:16:30
517.   cult of basebaal
at least Edwar's call up is exciting ... i was thinking about him alot yesterday while watching trevor hoffman pitch against the dodgers, that's trevor hoffman of the 500 saves, and the 84 mph "heat" ... but with his changeup, he's still making guys look silly
2007-07-01 11:17:16
518.   Jim Dean
514 The problem is when you make predictions you make them based on what's on paper at the beginning of the year.

If you had asked me about what would happen with injuries to Damon, Giambi, and no effort to get a 1B, I'd say their runs scored would have suffered, based on the bench. This team was supposed to succeed with an outstanding offense. With nothing to back it up, they were bound to fail if theings didn't break their way.

An average offense plus average pitching with a well below average bench = an average team.

2007-07-01 11:17:24
519.   williamnyy23
514 There are a few huge differences: namely a healthy Johnny Damon and Jason Giambi as well as a producitve Cano, Cabrera and Abreu. In the bullpen, Proctor and Villone were very useful in the first half and the bench did have a guy named Bernie (as well as a BUC who wasn't negative in the OPS+ department).

I am not suggesting that going into the season I though .500 was possible, but as early as mid to late April there were lots of signs that this was going to be a .500 team (check the Banter game logs and you'll see my comments at the time). Sure, there was a time in the first month where the team's ineptitude was a suprise, but by now, I don't think anyone should still be shocked. This team has .500 written all over it.

2007-07-01 11:18:02
520.   Alvaro Espinoza
516 One area that worried me was the below avg defense. But I never thought the team would tank like this.
2007-07-01 11:20:10
521.   monkeypants
514 Oh yeah--I agree that the "lack of RH power" should not have been that big of a deal. They have A-Rod and Jeter (not a HR hitter, but good for around a .470 SLG); Posada bats switch, and they HAD Phjelps on the bench--he historically had great splits againts LHP.
2007-07-01 11:23:55
522.   cult of basebaal
espn is breaking that mike hargrove is about to resign as mariner's manager ... press conference upcoming as to why
2007-07-01 11:24:05
523.   monkeypants
519 Fair enough, but that's kind of tautological. You're basically saying that at the beginning of the year you could not have predicted this. But AFTER you saw a series of major injuries, poor bench and personnel misuse, no moves made by the FO, and a number of underperformers--THEN you figured the chance that the team would play .500 ball.

Nostradamus would be proud!

2007-07-01 11:24:33
524.   51cq24
516, 518, 519 i agree with everything said, but it's still a shock to me that they continue to be this bad. this is not a .500 roster, even as is currently constituted. if we knew how bad the roster moves would be, maybe we could predict this. we knew how bad torre is, but it hasn't hurt them this much in the past. anyway, it is surprising that they aren't even in contention before the all star break.

and on bernie williams, obviously i agree.

521 exactly.

2007-07-01 11:24:54
525.   OldYanksFan
What Willy and Jim say are true, but this team did win 14 of 17, against some good teams, and it wasn't lucky.

We have plenty of holes, but when the 5spot of JD, Mats, Cano, ABreu and Melky all underperform... well we can't overcome that.

When that 5spot played well, we won. Despite all our problems, we looked unbeatable.

Every winning team has injuries and weaknesses. But like the White Sox, when a number of players are all underperforming, you don't win.

As bad as things look, we are not done yet.

2007-07-01 11:25:06
526.   monkeypants
522 How long until Hargove-Yankees rumors start?

Ha-ha..I just started them!

2007-07-01 11:25:23
527.   williamnyy23
521 As it turns out, the team really doesn't have ANY power outside of Arod.
2007-07-01 11:26:12
528.   williamnyy23
Shocking news on Hargrove...I would have expected a similar statement from Torre, but not Hargrove when you consider how well the Mariners have played.
2007-07-01 11:26:48
529.   monkeypants
525 "As bad as things look, we are not done yet."

I say here and now: we're done.

2007-07-01 11:29:36
530.   51cq24
holy fuck how many pop ups can abreu hit to left?
2007-07-01 11:29:58
531.   monkeypants
427 Jeter, A-Rod, and Posada are three regulars with .470+ SLG. Hmmm....two RH and a Switch-hitter. Maybe the problem was not enough LH power!
2007-07-01 11:30:48
532.   monkeypants
530 Come on man--that's WINNING BASEBALL. A nice sac fly, don't try for homers, don't clog the bases with walks.
2007-07-01 11:31:24
533.   51cq24
haha another instance of flaherty showing up kay. kay says the a's "just gave up a run" and flaherty says it would have been a clean single with the infield in.
2007-07-01 11:31:26
534.   monkeypants
Hey, who's this Phillips kid?
2007-07-01 11:31:44
535.   williamnyy23
531 That's what makes the loss of Giambi tough. If Matsui, Abreu and Cano aren' going to slug, the team really starts to look anemic outside of Arod.
2007-07-01 11:32:17
536.   51cq24
532 true, i forgot.
2007-07-01 11:35:03
537.   cult of basebaal
529 i won't say we're done, stranger things have happened in baseball, there are some moves we could make that would at least address some of the issues we've got (moving the deadweight in the BP ...) and yaneverknow ... but we're a mess for a lot of reasons and they're not all going away ...

so ... if we don't turn it around, i'm at peace with being done for this year ... and emphatically, i don't want to see a single young player traded in some misbegotten attempt to make it happen this year

2007-07-01 11:36:36
538.   williamnyy23
537 With 90 games left, I would hold off on saying that the team is done, but when moves that could be made get left undone, it makes me wonder if the organization has already thrown in the towel.
2007-07-01 11:37:13
539.   51cq24
what is he swinging at there? trying to foul off a ball?
2007-07-01 11:37:16
540.   williamnyy23
Damon has been really hard to watch this year. That AB sums up the Yankees offense.
2007-07-01 11:38:13
541.   51cq24
you want done?
2007-07-01 11:38:23
542.   cult of basebaal
thanks johnny, way to come up big and make contact there ...

c'mon cap'n, this is big

2007-07-01 11:39:21
543.   cult of basebaal
c'mon cano ... don't go all sniper on us
2007-07-01 11:40:04
544.   JeremyM
I really, really, really wish they'd put Damon on the DL for a spell.

Come on Cano.

2007-07-01 11:41:20
545.   Alvaro Espinoza
533 Caught that too. Flaherty is right though.
2007-07-01 11:41:46
546.   51cq24
shit i thought he hit that hard
2007-07-01 11:42:03
547.   williamnyy23
The difference between this and last year is Damon and Cano wouldn't have made out so meekly. This inning really illustrated the problem with this year's team.
2007-07-01 11:42:38
548.   cult of basebaal
2007-07-01 11:42:43
549.   Ramone
Two thoughts.

First, on today's game, do you get the feeling that the bats only loosened up because Oakland scored 8? Not the sign of a good team.

Second, I've been getting a little sick of the way the Yankees keep spouting off how anything short of winning the WS is a disappointment. The truth is that the Yanks have been flirting with disaster for a couple of seasons now. Notwithstanding the playoff meltdown last year, that team overachieved. It is one thing to shoot for the championship every year and it is another to act like your team SHOULD win every year.

2007-07-01 11:43:09
550.   williamnyy23
Why not just stack the lineup with Jeter, Posada and Arod and hope those three can generate runs?
Show/Hide Comments 551-600
2007-07-01 11:45:09
551.   Jim Dean
The 5spot involves alot of squinting.

Matsui: 60 points below career OPS. He's one hot week fgrom performing at expectations.

Melky: 30 points below career OPS. Again one hot week away.

That leaves a 3spot (Abreu, Damon, Cano). And their short-comings have been balanced by the outstanding seasons of Arod, Jeter, and Posada.

If anything, their lineup is performing exactly to expectations.

What kills the team is the Giambi injury and 1B. Given a healthy Giambi and an average 1B, they'd be very close to leading the league in runs scored. That they have no compentent replacements absolutely kills scoring.

Consider: They've given 330 AB's to Mghjfkd, Cairo, Phelps, and Nieves - that's more than any other player. And that's more than twice as many AB's they got from Giambi.

2007-07-01 11:46:43
552.   cult of basebaal
jesus, did aliens switch ron villone and andy pettite's respective talent before the game?
2007-07-01 11:47:01
553.   51cq24
549 "Second, I've been getting a little sick of the way the Yankees keep spouting off how anything short of winning the WS is a disappointment. The truth is that the Yanks have been flirting with disaster for a couple of seasons now."

huh? if the world series isn't the only success, then how have they been flirting with disaster by making the playoffs every year?

2007-07-01 11:47:14
554.   cult of basebaal
nice inning, no time for haren to catch his breath, now let's go get some more back
2007-07-01 11:47:52
555.   monkeypants
538 Nope--I'm not going to be seduced the ol' "there are still 90 games left" song. Historically, teams very rarely make up these sorts of deficits, and the teams that so (like 1978) were already playing good ball when the team(s) ahead of them started to cool down.

To continue to say that there is a lot of time left only makes it easier to commit to short-sighted moves.

Nope, this team is cooked. If they manage to make the playoffs, well I guess I'll eat crow. I'm not worried about that, however.

2007-07-01 11:48:27
556.   randym77
Holy crap. Pettitte gone already? o_O
2007-07-01 11:48:48
557.   williamnyy23
When and why did the ultimate road trip become a show that required a "viewer discretion advised" warning?
2007-07-01 11:49:25
558.   cult of basebaal
bad alex, bad ...
2007-07-01 11:51:55
559.   Jim Dean
553 One thing that occurred to me yesterday and put everything into perspective:

With the way Cashman and Torre have run the team and organization, I just can't see how they've ever win another ring with either of them in charge. If the goal is to win the Series, both Cashman and Torre need to be fired. It may mean disaster, but if they aren't going to win again, there's no reason to keep them around.

Consider: Cashman took a team that was winning series each year he started and his method of plug and play has turned them into a team that hasn't gotten out of the the ALDS in two and will be out of the playoffs this year.

2007-07-01 11:52:15
560.   cult of basebaal
554 so much for that wishful thinking ...
2007-07-01 11:53:04
561.   williamnyy23
555 I don't think anyone should be seduced by the 90 games remaining, but I don't see the need for making a "done declaration" so early. I too strongly believe this team is not going to end up much better than .500, and also wouldn't make any short term moves costing real talent. I would, however, dismiss Joe, replace Farns with Britton and try to acquire a league average 1B before giving up completely.
2007-07-01 11:53:13
562.   51cq24
557 i think it's a symptom of this season
2007-07-01 11:54:10
563.   Jim Dean
557 Seriously? That's funny. I wonder if with all the losing the cast has fallen into rampant drug and alcohol use.
2007-07-01 11:55:08
564.   monkeypants
559 just occurred to you a couple of days ago that Cashman is to blame for this? I mean, that's a revelation--you've been such a strong supporter of his all this time.

; )

2007-07-01 11:55:27
565.   51cq24
561 it's not that early anymore.

559 cashman can't be fired. i disagree with your assertion that they can't win with him as general manager, but even if i didn't i would still think that the type of disaster that would happen should cashman be fired is the type of disaster that would bring about another 18 year drought.

2007-07-01 11:55:34
566.   williamnyy23
559 I am not going to blame Cashman for Torre's blunders in the 2003 WS and 2004 ALCS. You could also argue that Cashman's acquistions allowed the team to make the playoffs in 2005 and 2006. I'd like to see Cashman have one more season without Torre (unless a bonafide GM star ala Billy Beane becomes available).
2007-07-01 11:55:34
567.   cult of basebaal
ah, the brian bruney experience, just what i've been waiting for
2007-07-01 11:57:00
568.   williamnyy23
563 The promo even has bleeped out curse words. Is that really necessary?
2007-07-01 11:57:01
569.   monkeypants
561 Fair enough. I just don't think that it's "early" in the context of the large deficits in both the division and WC races.
2007-07-01 11:58:02
570.   Ramone
553 Maybe I wasn't clear. I predicted pitching problems similar to this year's before last year began.

The hitting problems of this year exceed what I anticipated, but I have long been concerned about a leadership vaccuum in the clubhouse.

As I said, you always shoot to win it all. But there is no way that the Yanks were the favorites in 2006 or 2007.

The way they lost in the first series last year was surprising. That they lost was not.

2007-07-01 11:58:14
571.   Jim Dean
564 No, just as a counter to all the "If Cashman is fired, the Tampa cabal will kill the organization" worry.

Cashman can't produce a winning team. And it's not like he's had a short leash. He's been in the position for ten years, and the team has only gotten further and further from a championship. They have nothing to lose by making that change - they're already losing every year.

2007-07-01 12:01:20
572.   Alvaro Espinoza
What is Michael Kay talking about? What a buffoon...
2007-07-01 12:01:50
573.   Jim Dean
566 Why cause he knew Shawn Small would go 17-3 in the second half? Or that Boston would collapse in 2006?

565 It will be seven years, all under Cashman, this year since they last won a ring. What has Cashman done to convince you it won't be another seven year? Signing Pavano? Or Damon? Or Igawa? Or Clemens? That's 150 million just there.

2007-07-01 12:03:06
574.   cult of basebaal
jesus, are we really going to beat this dead horse again? it's not like anyone is going to all of a sudden stand up and say, "Eureka! You're right, i've been totally misguided in my thinking, thank you so much for that carefully elucidated treatise on why!"

let's talk about sun ra or national health care or puppy dogs and rainbows or something ...

2007-07-01 12:04:08
575.   51cq24
571 why did they lose in 01? because mariano blew a save. in 02? because the pitching was much worse than anyone could have expected, much worse than it should have been. in 03? because torre didnt put in rivera, because josh beckett pitched a great game. in 04? because mariano blew a save, because torre made awful decisions, because the great hitting was shut down. in 05? because randy johnson and mike mussina were bad. in 06? because the great pitching was shut down by a surprisingly good tigers team. because torre made some stupid roster moves.

cashman can't produce a winning team? that's stupid.

2007-07-01 12:04:57
576.   OldYanksFan
Prior to this game:
Matsui: 65 points below career OPS.
Melky: 40 points below career OPS
Cano: 90 points below career OPS.
Damon: 90 points below career OPS.
Abreu: 210 points below career OPS.
5Spot: 495 Point below career OPS

But I guess you're right, we're really losing because of DougOut and Nieves.

2007-07-01 12:05:07
577.   monkeypants
571 "Cashman can't produce a winning team. And it's not like he's had a short leash. He's been in the position for ten years, and the team has only gotten further and further from a championship."

I guess it depends on how "winning team" is measured. If it means winning the WS, they have gotten no further from winning. If it is how far one goes in the play-offs, then they got closer then farther, then closer, then farther. If it is putting together a team that wins a lot of games--assuming, as does Billy Beane, that the play offs tend to be a bit of a crap shoot--then again his record has been variable, though overall the success has been there.

Your mind is made up, and I don't really have a dog in this fight. But I do think that statements such as your above quote a bit overwrought.

2007-07-01 12:05:20
578.   Jim Dean
574 There are still alot of Cashman supporters out there (see 566). I'm just beating the bushes a bit after flogging the horse.

And me, I'd love to see an younger guy, with proven success, get promoted. Give the job to Oppenheimer and make Stick his assistant.

2007-07-01 12:06:13
579.   williamnyy23
573 Do you dispute that Small and Chacon were largely responsible for winning the 2005 AL East division? If so, you have to give Cashman credit. You simply can not deny him credit for moves that worked, but then knock him for the ones that do.
2007-07-01 12:07:11
580.   randym77
Andy Phillips: you can't stop him, you can only hope to contain him.
2007-07-01 12:08:16
581.   Ramone
559 My problem isn't with Torre or Cashman individually. It's that their styles don't complement each other.

Torre's strength is that he respects his players and doesn't get in their way. His weakness is that he doesn't fire up his team and doesn't get in player's faces.

Torre's weakness was masked in the 90's because he was blessed with vets like Tino and Paul O'Neill, who brought strong leadership qualities to the clubhouse, and young players like Jeter, Pettite, and Posada, who had strong characters.

Cashman's style is to deal to maximize the talent/$ ratio. That is fine, except there is no reason to think you will end up with strong, vocal leaders in the clubhouse. As a result you have a lot of underachieving players that Torre does a poor job of inspiring.

2007-07-01 12:08:25
582.   51cq24
what are the moves cashman should have made? which prospects should he have traded?
2007-07-01 12:13:26
583.   williamnyy23
Can Damon be any more a liability? At what point does Torre simply stop trotting him out there. Twice he swung at ball four in that AB.
2007-07-01 12:13:35
584.   cult of basebaal
another fine ab by gimpy johnny d ...
2007-07-01 12:15:02
585.   cult of basebaal
583 don't you know, kevin thompson is a figment of your imagination ... there's no way we could possible put thompson in rf and let abreu DH for a while with damon on the DL, that's just crazy talk
2007-07-01 12:15:31
586.   cult of basebaal
go jetes!!!
2007-07-01 12:16:44
587.   Jim Dean
575 He got handed a winning team. And in seven years turned it into what we have today.

576 If your numbers are right, Melky has already picked up 11 points today (-29 OPS) and Matsui has picked up 3 points (-62 OPS)

Meanwhile, I know it convenient for your argument to leave out this:

A-Rod: 142 points above career OPS
Jeter: 21 points above career OPS
Jorge: 77 points above career OPS
- - - - - - - - - - -
240 points above career OPS

Leaving Matsui and Melky aside - cause they just a bit under what would be expected of them - You've got a 3spot. And the downside of Cano and Damon has been more than made up for by the upside of Arod, Jeter, and Jorge.

So, you're right - Abreu has underperformed expectations. That has hurt.

And the 330 AB's of Mghjf, Cairo, Nieves, and Phelps means nothing for the offense.

2007-07-01 12:18:45
588.   cult of basebaal
jesus christ cano, even gameday says you pissed away that at bat on balls out of the zone, FUCK!
2007-07-01 12:19:06
589.   OldYanksFan
He did NOT come close to breaking his wrist! Was that really a swing???
2007-07-01 12:19:12
590.   51cq24
587 he was handed a winning team, won 3 straight world series, went to 2 of the next 3, and won the division every year. now the team is losing, and he's at fault. nevermind the mistakes that were clearly torre's fault in the playoffs. nevermind that they should have won at least 2 more world series, and clearly should have made it to another one, had it not been for some bad luck and/or torre blunders.
2007-07-01 12:19:19
591.   OldYanksFan
2007-07-01 12:20:19
592.   Jim Dean
579 To give someone credit for Shawn Small is to give them credit for a coin coming up heads two flips in a row.

582 There were many free agents this past off-season that could have helped: Huff, Gomez, Lieberthal, etc.

And when's he going to decide which pitchers can be traded of: White, Marquez, Smith, Henn, etc?

2007-07-01 12:20:57
593.   williamnyy23
When is Cano going to come close to resembling his 2006 form? He has know left 7 men on in key situations, which makes you wonder why Joe would bat him in the 3-hole. Did he know Cano entered the game batting .202 with RISP and .129 with RISP with two outs? Or, was he just rolling the dice with a gut feeling? This is another example of how a good manager could help a struggling team steal a few wins.
2007-07-01 12:21:23
594.   51cq24
587 and nevermind that he has to deal with the most overbearing owner in sports. and that we don't know for sure who was making the moves. and that cashman is the one who has a plan for the future.
2007-07-01 12:21:30
595.   fansince77
Has Cano EVER and I mean EVER not swung at a high fastball?
2007-07-01 12:21:43
596.   Jim Dean
590 If anything, Cashman has shown that the more decisions he makes, the worse the team gets. Is this point really that mysterious?
2007-07-01 12:23:04
597.   williamnyy23
589 It was a swing ...and another classic Cano strikeout on a pitch clearly out of the zone. Cano's struggles not only loom large this season, but for the future as well. I was counting on him being an All Star caliber player for years to come (and I'm sure Cashman was too). Now, I'm not so sure we aren't seeing the real Cano.
2007-07-01 12:23:53
598.   cult of basebaal
592 seriously, man, citing huff and lieberthal as people we should have signed?
2007-07-01 12:25:44
599.   williamnyy23
598 Huff's 88 OPS+ would fit right into this lineup!
2007-07-01 12:25:48
600.   Jim Dean
598 If the alternative is Mghdj, Phelps, and Nieves?
Show/Hide Comments 601-650
2007-07-01 12:26:08
601.   3rd gen yankee fan
Wifi in bars is awesome! Espcially with the team playing so darn well.
2007-07-01 12:26:24
602.   Jim Dean
600 Or starting Cairo at 1B?
2007-07-01 12:26:35
603.   OldYanksFan
OK. We have a net loss of .250 OPS PTS. That's hard. Add another .200+/- PTS from missing Giambi, and it's very touch.

My simply point is: When our 5 spot performed, and our BP was in a good streak (but not over their head), we won 14 of 17.

So I say, If our 5spot plays at 90% or better of their career OPS, we play .600 or better ball. You disagree?

And can Giambi give us 6 weeks of .800+ OPS?
Will Hughes give us 6 weeks of #3 or better?
Might JD heal a lot if we keep him at DH?
Might Cash put a rabbit out of his hat?
Might Roger get better as the season progresses? Possible?

We are playing very badly now, but there is still plenty of potential upside. we are down but not out.

Who agrees?

2007-07-01 12:26:44
604.   51cq24
596 has he really shown that? or has he shown that when he is in control he's not going to trade away the future and is all right if the team isn't perfect for a year or 2? you want to win right now AND keep the farm system intact? you want a general manager who can assure the team of success while also making sure none of the top prospects are traded away for more nonsense? i don't think you're thinking very clearly, or thoroughly. cashman has to be farsighted if we want to have another dynasty.

fuck myers. torre has to be fired.

2007-07-01 12:27:44
605.   Jim Dean
Meanwhile - Jack Cust - a player any team could have had for free.

Good thing Myers is on the team to pitch to lefties.

2007-07-01 12:28:03
606.   cult of basebaal
and lieberthal's 22 ops+ would too ... and huff is signed to a 3 year 20 million dollar deal to produce that 88 ops+ ... yeah, that's the kind of signing that would have helped
2007-07-01 12:28:06
607.   fansince77
Gee- I would love to see the stats on how many times NYY pitchers have been behind in the count from 2-0 to 3-0...recipe for disaster!
2007-07-01 12:28:13
608.   Yankees Brasil
Myers doing what he does best...
2007-07-01 12:28:25
609.   williamnyy23
And the comeback dies on the arm of Mike Myers. I apologize for beating the dead horse, but Myers has been awful against lefties all season, and yet Torre goes right back to the same poisoned well. Why? I guess because that's Myer's job. Once again, this is a game that a good manager could help the Yankees win. Instead, the Yankees have a bewildered manager grasping at straws. Fire Joe and this team has a chance. Allow him to finish the season out of loyalty is the same as a white flag.
2007-07-01 12:28:58
610.   Zack
Ahh, i see Myers is still proving he is useless, yet people will still claim eh "has value" because he caan "mop up" or "pitch to lefties" Useless...
2007-07-01 12:29:04
611.   51cq24
also, think about the message that would be sent to the next gm should cashman be fired. if you don't win this year, you'll be fired too. who would NOT trade away the farm system knowing that? nevermind that the person steinbrenner hand-picks will probably be under george's total control again.
2007-07-01 12:30:25
612.   51cq24
605 oh so picking up cust would have been credit-worthy, while chacon and small were just luck?
2007-07-01 12:31:04
613.   Zack
Ahh, I see that we have,. yet again, returned to letting Jim Dean repeat the same thigns over and over again. I liked the few days were peopel simply avoided the conversation or ignored it :)
2007-07-01 12:31:56
614.   cult of basebaal
605 well, technically, he was playing for the padres and beane had to trade for him, but don't let a few little facts get in the way of your ranting, eh?
2007-07-01 12:32:01
615.   Jim Dean
603 220 points of which are due solely to Abreu.

Your 5spot exists only in your mind. Just like the hope that Cashman can somehow help.

604 Cashman:

a) Consistently signs woeful players on the free agent market for ridiculous prices
b) Has yet to show he understadns the concept of team by stocking the bench with below replacement level players
c) Refuses to trade anything to help the current team

And he's a GM for a winning team, how? Because he's such a terrible evaluator of talent that he can't figure out out which of the 20 pitching prospects to trade?

2007-07-01 12:32:24
616.   cult of basebaal
613 i wanted to talk about puppy dogs and rainbows ...
2007-07-01 12:32:40
617.   williamnyy23
603 Not me. Here's the problem. Giambi is still in the boot. Hughes earliest ETA is August. Abreu and Cano have shown no signs of approaching their preseason career average OPS. Damon is the definition of walking wounded. Also, what happens when Arod and Posada regress even just a little. That has to be thrown into the equation.

I wont say the season is over because I've watched many years of baseball in which stranger things have happened, but my baseball observing experience also tells me this team is very close to done.

2007-07-01 12:33:37
618.   Zack
Ahh, Joe's favorite: bring in a new pitcher to then IBB walk a guy!
2007-07-01 12:34:28
619.   cult of basebaal
two days running ... hell, vizcaino two days running IIRC ...
2007-07-01 12:35:39
620.   seamus
nice K by Viz.

I've been so busy lately. And the way the Yanks have played, I'm glad for it.

2007-07-01 12:36:16
621.   Jim Dean
OPS+ is meaningless for a single season. Huff's career OPS+ of 111 would certainly have helped the team - at 1B and on the bench.

And Lieberthal is at least better than Nieves.

I love the response to name players. I do. Then I get hammered because the players aren't All-stars. The point is: The Yanks could easily have gone into the season with much better reinforcements than they had.

They didn't.

2007-07-01 12:37:20
622.   williamnyy23
The sad state of the Yankees has Vizcaino emerging as the best non-Mo reliever out of the bullpen. Looks like Viz' Yankee career could count as another save for Mariano.
2007-07-01 12:37:31
623.   seamus
nice job by viz.
2007-07-01 12:38:18
624.   51cq24
615 do you have a response to 611 or are you just going to say why you don't like cashman by making general comments like he "refuses to trade anything to help the current team"? who do you want to trade for anyway?
2007-07-01 12:38:28
625.   Zack
I think the problem, JD, is that you are inconsistant in your use of sample sizes. Sometimes, like in the case of Huff, sample sizes don't matter, other times, like with Viz, Abreu and some others, they make all the difference. You can't have it both ways...

So, are we going to see Ramirez, I am shocked Torre hasn't thrown him out there yet, but I guess we underestimate his rediculous loyalty...

Oh Gosh, and its Ronan Tynin's eternal GBA...

2007-07-01 12:40:24
626.   williamnyy23
621 Huff's last two seasons were an OPS+ of 98 and 106. When you consider his poor defense, he would be not be a much better option than DM (and certinaly not worth a 3-year deal). Lieberthal would have been a nice BUC.
2007-07-01 12:42:19
627.   williamnyy23
Why don't we have young right handed arms who can strike people out? Oh wait...
2007-07-01 12:42:27
628.   Jim Dean
611 Not if they promote from within. Someone who appreciates the depth they've built and recognozes the improvements that need to be made.
2007-07-01 12:42:44
629.   Zack
I wish Torre would take a hint from Hargrove (do you think he did something naughty or something?)
2007-07-01 12:43:32
630.   51cq24
621 and if he had signed huff and lieberthal and they were putting up the numbers they are putting up elsewhere here, would you say they were good moves? or would you call them "woeful players on the free agent market for ridiculous prices"?
2007-07-01 12:45:20
631.   51cq24
628 even if they promote from within, isn't the message "win now or be fired"?
2007-07-01 12:45:37
632.   cult of basebaal
629 supposedly he's just burned out and not "feeling the passion" anymore
2007-07-01 12:46:04
633.   williamnyy23
629 That thought had occurred to me before the winning streak. Instead of firing Torre, I was hoping Cashman could convince him to resign for the good of the team. Instead, I think Joe actually would want an extension. It isn't easy to give up the celebrity and the big salary.
2007-07-01 12:47:10
634.   Zack
632 Yeah, I read that, but it still seems like theres something were not being told, no?
2007-07-01 12:47:50
635.   williamnyy23
Matsui has escaped scrutiny, but his lack luster play has really hurt the team. At age 33, the Yankees have to also be worried about him going forward.
2007-07-01 12:48:22
636.   monkeypants
Does Kay call every pop fly a "drive" to the "deep" outfield?
2007-07-01 12:48:45
637.   Jim Dean
626 Actually Huff has a career RATE at 1B of 100 - he's the exact definition of an average 1B - thus much better than anything the Yanks have had in three years.

630 Lieberthal cost 1 million. It would be awful, but then what's Nieves.

And 1B - what was your solution? Or were you psyched about Mfghdgdj?

2007-07-01 12:49:14
638.   williamnyy23
636 YES!
2007-07-01 12:50:02
639.   Zack
Its funny that Haren, Beckett, and Verlander all got roughed up in their starts before the ASG...Who will start the game?
2007-07-01 12:50:26
640.   monkeypants
635 Yep. That was a bad deal, though given Matsui's popularity it would have been hard to let him walk. The last couple years of that contract could be painful.
2007-07-01 12:50:36
641.   Jim Dean
Meanwhile - Vizcaino is exactly the definition of an average pitcher (100 career ERA+). Britton could easily give that and it's very scary if he's the next dependable reliever after Mo - indeed this team has no chance.
2007-07-01 12:51:25
642.   51cq24
637 i thought phelps would be given a chance.
2007-07-01 12:53:51
643.   Jim Dean
631 No, it's:

a) Don't win in seven years; and
b) Drop 150 million on Damon, Pavano, Clemens, and Igawa; and
c) Fail to evaluate which B-prospects could be traded away for upgrades,

then get fired.

2007-07-01 12:54:09
644.   thelarmis
639 sabathia?
2007-07-01 12:55:11
645.   williamnyy23
I have a Friday game plan and most of the fans in my section would always joke about how the team never wins on Friday. Now, it appears as if Friday is the only day they can win...not the trade off I was looking for.
2007-07-01 12:55:49
646.   Zack
Jim, not winning in 2003 is hardly Cashman's fault. He put a team out there that made it to the WS and should have won it, how is that his fault?
2007-07-01 12:55:58
647.   cult of basebaal
641 yeah, and his last 3 years before this one?

era+ of 110, 119, 133 ... see a trend? again, with the cherry-picking, eh?

2007-07-01 12:56:49
648.   cult of basebaal
643 again, what impact trades are out there for our B- prospects? hmmm?
2007-07-01 12:57:13
649.   Zack
643 i don't see hwo you can say that the Abreu trade didn't answer c, as well as the Justice trade, the Knoblauch trade. All of those represent exactly that...
2007-07-01 12:58:09
650.   3rd gen yankee fan
I wanna see Proctor build a bonfire on the mound & dance around it.
Show/Hide Comments 651-700
2007-07-01 12:58:49
651.   Zack
647 no no no, past years only apply when they show Jim Dean being right, don't you know anything? In Viz's case, its all about the small sample size...Duh...

And now Proctor is up..again. Torre just refuses to pitch a kid. Rediculous. Because Proctor hasn't pitched enough or anything. This is why he must go, well, one of the reasons...

2007-07-01 12:59:03
652.   williamnyy23
Proctor warms...the game is almost out of hand...why not try Ramirez? Torre's rigid blindness is infuriating. Losing would be much more tolerable if I knew the team had a manager not adding to its troubles.
2007-07-01 13:00:23
653.   Jim Dean
647 It's called career ERA+ - that's not cherry picking but looking only at the last three years is. Relievers are streaky because they pitch so few innings. Indeed, the last three years equal one year of a starter.

646 They lost in six games. They shouldn't have won anything.

2007-07-01 13:00:56
654.   monkeypants
637 I doubt many people here were happy with the Minky deal. The problem is that you are inconsistent in your evaluation of Cashman. Has he made mistakes--sure, plenty of them (Pavano, Minky, etc.). And you rightly criticize him for these. But then you go through contortions not to give him credit for good moves that he made.

Getting A-Rod was brilliant (I think)--but then you have downplayed this before by saying that it was no brainer. OK, but he certainly found great value with Chacon in 2005--but then you say this was luck. But then you just slammed him for not finding Jack Cust--but Cust has been a career journeyman and minor leaguer; to credit Beane for pulling him from the dustbin is, to use your own analogy and logic, to praise someone for a coin flipping heads two times in a row 592.

Is Cashman a good or bad GM? It's a good topic for a reasonable discussion. Does he often get a free pass, with any bad move blamed on the "Tampa cabal"--no doubt. But your incessant blaming of Cashman for ALL of the problems with the team--including tactical errors that Torre has made (you did earlier fault Cashman for Cairo at 1B--and never giving him any credit for any moves that have worked out well, is just as one sided.

Enjoy; I remove myself from this conversation now while I watch Jack Cust probably hit a grand slam.

2007-07-01 13:04:24
655.   Jim Dean
654 I praised him for the Abreu and A-Rod deals. Pettitte too. And the Sheff trade at the time (but if he knew that Humberto would need TJ - that's an idiotic trade).

Cust - I criticized all teams. He had never been given 20 consecutive AB's in the majors. The Yankees were never going to be the team to give him that.

2007-07-01 13:05:26
656.   Zack
Jim, career era + for a reliever really doesn't matter that much, especialyl if the last three years have shown a consistant increase. I am sure if a relievers career era+ was great, but the last three years showed a steady decrease, you would agree to.
2007-07-01 13:05:46
657.   Jim Dean
Who was just calling Vizcaino "dependable"?
2007-07-01 13:05:48
658.   williamnyy23
Here comes EDSP...Joe's ineptness has become comical, almost as hysterical as Kay's lead-out, "Did the ritualist burning of his equipment work...we'll find out when we come back".
2007-07-01 13:06:46
659.   Jim Dean
656 It matters much more as a career estimate than in looking for trends.
2007-07-01 13:08:02
660.   Zack
655 Yet you also calim that anyone over 26 isn't a prospect and should only get those types of chances to prove themselves. Again, consistancy

Why the hell is Proctor pitching, again, in a blowout? Dear God, and Joe wonders why his BP is ineffective

2007-07-01 13:08:02
661.   JeremyM
I'm so glad the Yanks called up a fresh arm today.
2007-07-01 13:08:34
662.   yankz
613 I generally go with the ignore route. I think a few people around here haven't learned how horribly boring it gets. I can repeat things more than you can!
2007-07-01 13:09:04
663.   monkeypants
[655 No, you didn't criticize all teams. You cited that he could have been had for free specifically in the context of Cashman's failure to build a deeper team. Well, he made the same mistake that 28 other GMs did (as you note), so that tells us little about his ability as GM (unless it shows that all GMs except Beane are bad--but that doesn't further the discussion much either).
2007-07-01 13:09:25
664.   cult of basebaal
we want edwar, we want edwar, we want edwar (assuming joe bothered to give him a uniform)
2007-07-01 13:11:00
665.   Zack
So what do we think the over/under on Ramirez pitching the 9th? or does Mo need some "work"?
2007-07-01 13:11:16
666.   monkeypants
662 You are wise for years, Grasshopper.
2007-07-01 13:12:14
667.   3rd gen yankee fan
Hideki looks like his acne is acting up.
2007-07-01 13:12:47
668.   yankz
666 Thank you, friend.

664 665 Edwar = Henry Roengardner!

2007-07-01 13:12:54
669.   bartap74
Can we call a do-over for the season?
2007-07-01 13:12:56
670.   51cq24
659 we all know perfectly well what this is about, you want me to have an abortion.

bye everyone. yankees blow.

2007-07-01 13:13:02
671.   Zack
No Kay, its not a "virtual" free fall, it IS a free fall...
2007-07-01 13:14:06
672.   Zack
I am only watching this game to see Ramirez, so he better pitch
2007-07-01 13:14:15
673.   thelarmis
maybe edwar will pitch the 9th. perhaps torre didn't want to bring him in in the middle of an inning with runners on base. who knows, i'm sure we'll find out very soon...
2007-07-01 13:15:44
674.   cult of basebaal
670 looks like i picked the wrong week to stop sniffing glue ...

672 me too

2007-07-01 13:16:14
675.   monkeypants
671 Yep. Kay and Co. need to stop talking about injuries, and inconsistency and getting hot and getting going. They need to just come out and say, this is a bad team in the midst of a bad season (Kay ALMOST got there right at the end of the inning).
2007-07-01 13:17:01
676.   thelarmis
so much for my theory...
2007-07-01 13:17:34
677.   Zack
I hate you Joe Torre. You and your inexplicable love of Scott Proctor. For the love of God, its a blowout and you ahve a fresh arm!

I'm out, Fire Joe, now, I now hate him...

2007-07-01 13:18:02
678.   yankz
Are you KIDDING me?! RON GUIDRY said Proctor's probably too overworked YESTERDAY. WTF IS WRONG WITH YOU JOE TORRE?!
2007-07-01 13:19:34
679.   yankz
Zack- he's just keeping the game close so The Best Lineup In Baseball can come back in the 9th.
2007-07-01 13:19:38
680.   Zack
I'm out...have a better day than the Yanks. I hate you Joe Torre
2007-07-01 13:20:01
681.   Ramone
The one Cashman move that I'm surprised hasn't gotten more attention was his handling of Bernie Williams.

Obviously Bernie's CF skills were in considerable decline before this year but it seems like it would be nice to have another option besides Melky.

Also, it wouldn't kill us to have another switch-hitter off the bench (even if Bernie has been a histrorically lousy PH).

But more than all that, wouldn't it have been great to have another veteran leader in the clubhouse? It seems like Cashman (and I am in the some blame/some credit camp) really undervalues intangibles in anyone besides Derek Jeter.

2007-07-01 13:20:11
682.   williamnyy23
I give up on least he should be gone after this season.
2007-07-01 13:20:14
683.   yankz
Arod's going to bat in the least it'll be 11-6.
2007-07-01 13:20:35
684.   3rd gen yankee fan
at this point we're only thrown together by habit. we come to the banter and see familiar faces and nod, oh, you're here again, nice to see you, does the team still suck? then we pause, the faithful, the 5,000 who still remain when the 45,000 have left the stadium in the 7th, still raining still dreaming, see you tomorrow as painful as it is and will be.
2007-07-01 13:21:02
685.   cult of basebaal
dudes, when you fall off the horse, you gotta right back on, man ... right back on

sigh ... it's like torre desperately wants out, but doesn't want to resign, and is trying everything to get the organization to fire him

2007-07-01 13:21:18
686.   JeremyM
I think that was nice of Joe, giving Proctor the chance to get his ERA under 4.00.
2007-07-01 13:21:46
687.   monkeypants
677 678 It was wrong to bring him in to begin with, but once he made that decision, it's better to use Proctor for four outs in this blowout than to bring in yet another pitcher--save the fresh arm for the next game.
2007-07-01 13:22:40
688.   cult of basebaal
681 considerable? his arm is worse than damon's and he plays the outfield with all the aplomb of a drunk falling down stairs
2007-07-01 13:23:19
689.   yankz
I bet Boston comes back vs Tex.
2007-07-01 13:23:54
690.   yankz
Oh Jeter, why must you tease me.
2007-07-01 13:24:08
691.   cult of basebaal
687 well, except do you actually believe he's going to pitch ramirez tomorrow if the game is close? if ramirez is at the game today, today was the game to let him get his feet wet ...
2007-07-01 13:24:27
692.   monkeypants
681 Are you kidding? Can you imagine if Torre had Cairo and Bernie? The horror, the horror...
2007-07-01 13:24:38
693.   thelarmis
captain doing what captain does
2007-07-01 13:25:18
694.   yankz
Dummy Cano. Dummy Me for thinking he'd do well in the 3 hole.
2007-07-01 13:25:28
695.   monkeypants
691 No, but a man can dream can't he?
2007-07-01 13:25:50
696.   cult of basebaal
cano doing what cano does ...
2007-07-01 13:26:11
697.   thelarmis
689 there's no doubt. i thought it already would've happened by now.

hargrove's last game is with weaver pitching. you would think he would've resigned before the game, not after...

2007-07-01 13:26:38
698.   cult of basebaal
i try not to let my dreams involve joe torre in any way, shape, or form ...
2007-07-01 13:28:16
699.   thelarmis
the supposed anemic A's offense has scored 18 runs off us in the last 2 games. great.
2007-07-01 13:28:28
700.   yankz
Rough day for Cano. First he tanks in the game, then he gets caught on camera picking his nose.
Show/Hide Comments 701-750
2007-07-01 13:28:54
701.   yankz
I hope Cano is watching this AB.
2007-07-01 13:29:12
702.   3rd gen yankee fan
2007-07-01 13:31:05
703.   yankz
I'm glad Arod hasn't changed his approach. If I had that talent and played on this team, I'd try to be hero every AB knowing it's pretty much the only way to win.
2007-07-01 13:31:56
704.   yankz
We play today, we get humiliated today.
2007-07-01 13:32:39
705.   3rd gen yankee fan
Cubbies won, yay.
2007-07-01 13:37:24
706.   cult of basebaal
gnite all, and remember, sweet liquor eases the pain ...
2007-07-01 13:41:23
707.   Ramone
688 My point isn't that you'd want Bernie for the skill set he currently possesses -- defense in particular. It's that (despite the protestations that Minky was never a replacement for Bernie) Cashman doesn't seem to think twice about dumping a proven winner for a proven clubhouse distraction.

Do I want Bernie as a starter? Hell, no. Do I want him in the clubhouse instead of just one of the half dozen mediocre to poor 1B players we've got? Yes.

Although the argument that Torre wouldn't be able to restrain himself from playing Bernie does have merit...

2007-07-01 13:48:24
708.   yankz
707 Further proof that Joe must go.
2007-07-01 13:54:16
709.   WeMissPaulie
And the worst part is that Boston is literally teasing us by losing a few games this past week....we just cant take advantage of it.
2007-07-01 13:58:30
710.   thelarmis
709 ah, don't worry, yankz and i are banking on them to come back and win todays ballgame. : ~
2007-07-01 14:20:23
711.   Chyll Will
706 So does good old-fashioned street violence >;)

Speaking of which, I won't be around for a while since I'm on another indie film gig, but check me out every now and then at my new spot, for those who know. I posted Part IV Friday night, for anyone who know what that means. Shaun (if you get this), the cartoons are coming very shortly; I'm starting with some classics.

Just trying to spread some cheer; you can ignore me as usual. I can't even mention the games directly anymore, that's how it's gotten. Well, I guess this means more time to learn the popular Banter language and contribute something of measured value (but is that honestly a good thing for Banter? We will see...) >;)

2007-07-01 14:47:44
712.   Zack
Continuing the trend of Trenton being by far the more interesting team than the Yanks, Kennedy pitched 5 no hit innings with 3BB and 9K to put his Trenton era at 2.32 and hsi overall season line at 1.63, 94 IP, 58H, 3HR, 33BB, 111K, .180 BAA, .77 GO/AO. Plus brett Gardener has been en fuego and is up over .300 now (due for a promotion in another few weeks)...

Kennedy should be in AAA by the end of the season, the only thing holding him back being IP. Hes already up to 94 and they are doing the 5 IP limit thing clearly. But that puts him on pace for a mid-late season call up next year, awesome...keep it up kid, you are our are salvation! :)

2007-07-01 15:15:20
713.   randym77
They finally announced the All-Star roster:

Ivan Rodriguez C
David Ortiz 1B
Placido Polanco 2B
Alex Rodriguez 3B
Derek Jeter SS
Vlad Guerrero OF
Magglio Ordonez OF
Ichiro Suzuki OF

2007-07-01 15:18:50
714.   randym77
Here's the backups:

C Victor Martinez, CLE
C Jorge Posada, NYY
1B Justin Morneau, MIN
2B Brian Roberts, BAL
SS Carlos Guillen, DET
SS Michael Young, TEX
3B Mike Lowell, BOS
OF Carl Crawford, TB
OF Torii Hunter, MIN
OF Manny Ramirez, BOS
OF Alex Rios, TOR
OF Grady Sizemore, CLE

And the pitchers:

P Josh Beckett, BOS
P Dan Haren, OAK
P Bobby Jenks, CWS
P John Lackey, LAA
P Gil Meche, KC
P Jon Papelbon, BOS
P J.J. Putz, SEA
P Francisco Rodriguez, LAA
P C.C. Sabathia, CLE
P Johan Santana, MIN
P Justin Verlander, DET

2007-07-01 15:20:08
715.   monkeypants
I-Rod. sigh.
2007-07-01 15:26:22
716.   Vandelay Industries

Well. At least there are only two guys on that starting roster that we should have signed. One for nothing, and one which was as obvious as the nose on your face.

2007-07-01 15:39:10
717.   Vandelay Industries

I agree with most of what you said about Cashman. Sign Pavano after only one good year in his 5 year career. Let Duque walk for pennies. Let Lieber walk for pennies. Let the bench go to shit. Pass on Guerrero, umm ok. Pass on Beltran and sign're fired. Isn't there another 40+ pitcher you can sign? Another career minor league BUC? Maybe you can pick up another $17 million right fielder after passing on Beltran.

As for Joe Torre. Family problems? Maybe if the father wasn't such a pussy, his kids wouldn't have to go to the neighbors for help! These kids are most assuredly not "Safe at Home" Joe. I respect Andy Pettitte's and Jorge Posada's analysis of this club a whole lot more than I trust Torre's opinion. If there really are guys not trying, get a manger in here who will get in their faces, or a GM who will trade them to Pittsburgh or Kansas City. And what the hell does Kay know about guys being prideful and not wanting to be told they are not trying. I've played organized sports, and there has never been a shortage of guys getting by on natural ability who couldn't care less about winning, or what was said about them. I'm sure there is no shortage of guys treating this like what it is, a job, and to think they all care what is said about them as they cash a check for $300,000 every two weeks is laughable.

2007-07-01 15:47:43
718.   JL25and3
Well, Kay also did speak admirably of players on the old Yankee teams who would get in a player's face if they thought he was mailing it in - Tino, Darryl, Chili Davis, Tim Raines. So I guess there were players then who didn't always seem to be giving their all...
2007-07-01 15:49:40
719.   Vandelay Industries

Exactly! And then Joe had players to do his job. Now he does not, and he sure isn't qualified to do it.

2007-07-01 15:56:15
720.   yankz
David Wright is arguably the third best the NL East.

I-Rod is, at best, the 3rd best catcher in the AL.

I hate the All-Star Game.

2007-07-01 15:59:35
721.   JL25and3
720 The way to deal with it is not to care. So Yvonne Rodriguez got picked again - so what? What's the big injustice? It's only an exhibition game. It doesn't count for anything.
2007-07-01 17:22:00
722.   Vandelay Industries

Most notably because it wont matter to the Yankees who wins the game.

2007-07-01 17:37:12
723.   Vandelay Industries
Just from watching the Detroit/Minnesota game, it seems pretty clear we cannot beat either of them, much less the Red Sox.

It's serendipitous that the Bronx in Burning is running this year. Joe has no more control over the clubhouse than Martin did. Joe just lets players walk all over him rather than attempt to assert his authority. I cannot express strongly enough that the powers that be should have let Joe go and brought in Piniella. Trade Joe, who is more aristocrat than anything else, for a basball man.

2007-07-01 17:56:53
724.   yankz
723 Yeah, because Piniella has done a fantastic job managing the Cubs' clubhouse. Nobody fights or anything!
2007-07-01 18:06:26
725.   Vandelay Industries

Agreed. But at least guys seem to care about something. I'd be happy if the Yankees showed some enthusiasm about anything.

2007-07-01 18:08:12
726.   yankz
725 You'd be happy if Jorge and Andy started punching each other?
2007-07-01 18:09:19
727.   Vandelay Industries

And you have to admit that you cannot compare Torre to Piniella when it comes to managing a game and putting players in the best position to win. Its not like Piniella would let Damon limp around half the year.

But then again, if only a handful of guys care whether they win or lose, not much Joe can do about that.

2007-07-01 18:10:36
728.   Vandelay Industries
Don't be silly. Andy and Jorge are not Zambrano and Barrett. Maybe Moose and That I would like to see.
2007-07-01 18:13:48
729.   Vandelay Industries
I don't think Piniella would be flip flopping the lineup every day, never giving any change a chance to work, if that is indeed why he flip flops them around. Need I remind you that Joe is the man who dropped Arod to eighth in the order?
2007-07-01 18:17:14
730.   Vandelay Industries
Not to mention that he batted the best all around hitter in our lineup the last 11 years leadoff and then second. When it is widely recognized that your number three hitter should be your best all around hitter. Then he went with Damon at leadoff, with a lower OBP and AVG than Jeter. Starting Kevin Brown in game seven? Nothing the man does makes any sense.
2007-07-01 18:53:32
731.   51cq24
726 maybe they could gang up on abreu.

730 what are you talking about? you think jeter should have been hitting 3rd for the last 11 years, but leadoff for the last 2? he should be leading off, and should have been forever.

720 cabrera is definitely a better hitter, but a much worse defensive 3b. but i pretty much agree with you.

716 now we should have signed magglio ordonez?

2007-07-01 19:14:37
732.   Vandelay Industries

I disagree. He should be batting third, should have always batted third. While the Yankees should have found a lead-off man somewhere at some point. Jeter himself knows this, but he's not the kind to rock the boat. He has gladly sacrificed statistics for what Joe Torre thought was best for the team.

But even if you're right, then Torre is still doing what is at best the third most viable option for Jeter.

We win despite Joe, not because of him.

2007-07-01 19:30:19
733.   weeping for brunnhilde
694 Hey, yankz, that's pretty uncanny that the day after you float Cano in the third hole, Cano's in the third hole.

Was that your idea, or did you hear it somewhere? If the former, man, that's really fucking uncanny.

As to its wisdom, we'll see. The thing is, though, if it's to be tried, it should be tried, say for at least two weeks.

But you can't just put him there randomly, you have to actually prepare him for the role with sound coaching.

Sometimes I wonder if there's much coaching being done on the team.

You see the other team's hitters punching the ball up the middle and you see ours hitting lazy flyballs and you have to wonder...

2007-07-01 19:34:09
734.   weeping for brunnhilde
703 I agree with you, yankz. Last year, not so much, but this year it's what the team needs.

Honestly, I have to wonder whether there's a correlation between losing Sheff and Giambi and seeing such heightened play from Alex.

I wonder if he's more relaxed not having to compete with the other sluggers, but being the undisputed Guy.

2007-07-01 19:37:07
735.   weeping for brunnhilde
709 I know, I noticed that too!

Didn't they even get swept this week?

If we'd been able to hold the line at 8 or so, we could be down to like 5 games by now if we played some baseball.

So frustrating.

2007-07-01 19:46:05
736.   Zack
Pete Aberaham clearly had a very bad Sunday b/c his last two blog entries are him at his high horse worst. Actually three if you count his crap write up about Edwar. Bashing Josh Phelps again (for no reason), poo-pooing anyone who uses stats AND people who cite minor league players #s, and then, wait for it, back to the "Phil Hughes can't stay on the field so don't expect anything from hin" nonesense. I suppose he still feels it necessary to calim he was right all along about Hughes not pitching in the majors or some crap, but he is getting worse and worse
2007-07-01 19:56:12
737.   yankz
733 I just thought it up; he's a solid power threat when on, and the only way he's "on" is when he gets easy pitches. Sandwiched between Captain and A-God should theoretically get him easy pitches.
2007-07-01 20:07:02
738.   weeping for brunnhilde
737 Agreed. I'd like to see him stay there for awhile.

Still, it doesn't solve the problem of how to help the man grow into the hitter he could be.

2007-07-01 20:45:39
739.   randym77
I just heard Basak is being sent down. Who's being called up?

Reds manager Jerry Narron got canned tonight. Yahoo is reporting that Girardi interviewed for the Reds job twice last week, but turned it down because they wanted him to keep some of the existing coaching staff.

2007-07-01 20:46:13
740.   weeping for brunnhilde
I just checked out a trailer for the Bronx is Burning. Man, it actually looks solid!

I'm jazzed for it.

Too bad it's made for tv, though. Should have been produced HBO-style, sans commercials.

Oh well, can't have everything.

2007-07-01 20:47:12
741.   yankz
739 I believe he was sent down for Edwar.
2007-07-01 20:51:28
742.   yankz
I had to steal this from a poster at LoHud because it's so cool:

"p1ɹoʍ uʍop ǝpısdn ɐ uı ʇ1nɐɟ ʇɐ sı ɐpɐsod"

Also, one proposed an Alan Horne for Carlos Zambrano trade. I kid you not.

Why was I there, you ask? Hey, the Yankees are depressing, I needed cheering up.

2007-07-01 21:52:47
743.   randym77
741 Thanks. I didn't know he'd been called up.

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