Baseball Toaster Bronx Banter
Black Cat Bone
2008-04-23 05:42
by Emma Span
Chien-Ming Wang teetered on the brink of disaster throughout his six innings against the White Sox last night, but somehow allowed only three runs, so in the end -- after the Yankee offense poked its head out and didn’t see its shadow -- New York won 9-5. The Yanks are now one game over .500, and at with his fourth W of the season, Wang is the fastest major league pitcher to 50 wins since Doc Gooden. (Obligatory disclaimer: wins are an extremely unreliable and inaccurate stat, etc. Still, that's impressive).

Starting for the White Sox was old frenemy Jose Contreras, another in the long line of big-money free agent busts in New York who’ve gone on to success elsewhere. (He gets a pass, though, since his family was trapped in Cuba most of the time he was with the Yankees. You can see how that might be a tad bit distracting. What’s your excuse, Vazquez?). Contreras pitched a solid game, allowing just one first inning run, when Johnny Damon scored on a Matsui ground out, and one inning later a solo home run from the hollow husk of Jason Giambi. Then he settled in and, like many an April pitcher before him, stifled the Yankees’ offense.

Wang, meanwhile, struggled from the start, throwing almost 50 pitches in the first two innings alone as the White Sox put three quick runs up. (He wasn't helped by an error on Morgan Ensberg, who was subbing in for Alex Rodriguez at third base. A-Rod, of course, was on paternity leave in Florida, with his wife and newborn daughter.... or, as the Daily News would have it, "welcoming a bouncing bambina into [his] pinstriped world"). After that Wang was somwhat more efficient, but also lucky: the White Sox had a plethora of very hard hit line drives and fly balls land just within reach of the Yankee outfielders. And by the end, Chicago had stranded 13 runners.

The Yankees finally got a little momentum going, and loaded the bases in the 7th – single, walk, infield single – which brought Derek Jeter to the plate with one out. He struck out, and perhaps as a result, looked like the happiest man in Chicago one batter later, when Bobby Abreu whacked Octavio Dotel's 2-0 pitch just over the left field wall for a go-ahead grand slam.

In the bottom of the inning, perhaps concerned that things might get dull for the viewers at home, Billy Traber and Brian Bruney worked together to load the bases, which brought in Joba Chamberlain. Joba looked good under the circumstances -- well, aside from walking in a run -- and in the YES booth, David Cone kept gushing about his “moxie,” an excellent word that people just don’t use enough anymore. (Side note: I think Cone’s doing a good job on the whole... but you can just tell he’s dying to curse up a storm, and to tell several dozen potentially libelous stories. I'd love to hear him really cut loose, though I expect the FCC and certain former teammates would not.)

After a three-run homer from Johnny Damon in the eighth – cancel the obit, I think he’s fogging up the mirror! – and another solid inning from Chamberlain, Kyle Farnsworth brought his own special brand of excitement to the ninth inning. But one quick home run, walk, fielder's choice and wild pitch later, the Yankees nailed down the win.

I'm not sure it's even worth bringing up, but in the eighth inning, a black cat ran out of the stands, across the field, and straight into the Yankees dugout. I've decided to simply ignore this, not being the superstious type. (Though once, in college, I was walking across a courtyard at night, when not one but two black cats ran directly in front of me, one after the other… then proceeded to have loud sex in the bushes next to my dorm. I admit, that did give me pause.)

Finally, announcer Paul O’Neill finally asked the big burning question on all of our minds: “How can they wear black socks when they’re called the White Sox? That just doesn’t make any sense to me.”

Next time on YES: Why do we drive on parkways but park on driveways?

Comments (72)
Show/Hide Comments 1-50
2008-04-23 06:20:07
1.   RIYank
"...then proceeded to have loud sex in the bushes next to my dorm."

I like to think that's how I would have reacted, too, but in my more honest moments I have to admit that I'm too prudish.

2008-04-23 06:21:29
2.   ChrisS
Another riddle for the ages: Why are the major talking heads absolutely unified in their desire to see Joba Chamberlain remain in the 'pen? Every time I read an article it seems, or catch Beisball Tonighty, there's some knucklehead(Steve Phillips, Buck Showalter, Karl Ravech, etc.) stating that the Yankees would be mistaken to make Joba a starter. Where are those devil's advocates? Doesn't Skip Bayless make his living by taking the unpopular media opinion and shouting about it? Wilbon? Steven A. Smith? And, damn, I can't stand the White Sox announcers.

Sorry, I'm crotchety on this beautiful morning in Gilroy (Garlic Capital of the World!). Anyway, nice write-up, Emma.

2008-04-23 06:23:45
3.   Emma Span
1 I walked right into that one.
2008-04-23 06:38:45
4.   jaffe
"(Obligatory disclaimer: wins are an extremely unreliable and inaccurate stat, etc. Still, that's impressive). "

When it comes down to it I sure rather have a pitcher who is lucky and wins than a pitcher who has wonderful stats and loses. When did it become unfashionable to win. I just don't get it.

2008-04-23 06:40:08
5.   williamnyy23
4 It's not unfashionable to's just become unfashionable to uses wins as the foundation for making a case about the quality of a pitcher.

Does anyone know whom the Yankees will face on Friday now that Westbrook is on the DL?

2008-04-23 06:55:30
6.   horace-clarke-era
1 Emma gave us all pause, actually, especially on first coffee of the morning. Ellipses are dangerous punctuation marks, Emma.

I am unsure how it happened that I have become a Principal in the 'Johnny Damon's OK' section here, but I'd say he's really doing more than fog the mirror ... the obp (he's a lead off, remember!) is now at career average. Yes, I would rather it be there with a .280 batting average (that means more rbis) but for a dreadful, horrific, dump the bum slow start ... not that shabby. That ball got out FAST last night - and was no Cue Ball to Corner Right Field Pocket shot - for a guy who swings one-handed.

My wish list is now focused on Cano getting it together a month (two?) earlier than last year and ONE of Phil/Ian arriving as tolerable. (Two is pushing it in a wish list, right?) I hope I am wrong, but my expectations for the Giambino are very very limited. Maybe a hot month in there?

I share the bemusement at people wanting Joba kept for the 8th. I did find Cone interesting on the issue of his using only 2 pitches in relief and needing time and focus to bring the other two back. THAT is a good commentator's point. I CAN see a case if both IPK and PKH step up big, there's no urgency to finding him in the rotation except that - as discussed yesterday - he does need to get towards 130 innings or the whole process gets repeated next year. There ARE challenges to competing this year and setting up the future at the same time.

I thought the lovefest with Paulie on the number just outright sucked. I know WHY they were all kissing in the booth, but it was embarrassing. 'I doubt you know this, but Jeter and Posada and Mariano all went to talk to Hawkins ...' 'Thanks, guys!'


2008-04-23 06:55:47
7.   bp1
"the hollow husk of Jason Giambi".


2008-04-23 07:00:06
8.   Chyll Will
1 I like the outdoors and all (I really, really do), but what a waste of a perfectly good dorm room...

I dunno if I necessarily like Cone yet. He makes me kinda twitchy when he talks; I sense the same thing you do about his restraining himself, but to me it seems like he's a tad bitter about having to do so, and it colors his own commentary a bit. You almost get the sense he'd rather be in the dugout coaching.

Okay, I've found the downside of letting Billy Crystal play; he'll be on the talk show circuit for the rest of his life talking about it, and that will eventually seep into every performance he ever does on stage or film. There're few things more annoying than someone who realizes a dream of theirs and won't shut up about it after it's gotten old.

(Not cranky, just hungry >;)

2008-04-23 07:00:49
9.   bp1
And speaking of Paul O'Neill, Michael Kay sometimes plays radio show announcer when calling games, trying to get Paul to talk about the whole Letroy Hawkins thing. He was just about begging Paul to say "I thought the fans were wrong to boo Hawkins for wearing my number", but it wasn't gonna happen.

Michael Kay - just call the game. Leave the other crap to your radio show. Baseball was happening on the field, and you guys were talking about a that crap? Gimme a break.

2008-04-23 07:03:22
10.   rbj
Sex in the bushes? Well where else are you going to have it?

The burning question for me was why the game was blacked out on EI. Wasn't on WGN either.

2008-04-23 07:03:56
11.   mehmattski
According to ESPN radio this morning, Wang is the fastest to 50 wins in Yankee history. While "wins" don't carry that much weight, "Yankee history" certainly does. Impressive.

4 Have you ever tried explaining "wins" to a sports fan just getting interested in baseball? Watching their brains try and spin their way around that one is pretty comical, and telling. It was back in the 1920s that sports writers first started to realize that "wins" were not the best way to characterize a pitcher, so they came up with Earned Run Average.

On a certain level, though, I agree with you, but probably not in the way you meant. If my team has a pitcher with lots of "wins," that means my team has a good offense (enough that if my pitcher gives up 5 runs in 7 innings he can still get the win); it means my team has a good bullpen (to not blow those 6-5 leads my pitcher leaves with); and most importantly, my team has a lot of wins. For a team, wins are the most important thing, but assigning credit and blame to just one player is downright insane, given the way baseball is set up.

Here's a list of pitchers, since 1993, who have had more than 10 losses with an ERA+ above 150:

Now, here's a list of pitchers, since 1993, who have had 15 wins with an ERA+ below 100:

Tell me.... from which group of pitchers would you like to select your staff?

2008-04-23 07:05:38
12.   Fred Vincy
Emma -- were you in Berkeley? The cats in the mote there were outrageous when I was there in the 80s.

Separately, I hate to be uncharitable to Contreras, but I think they finally dumped him when, after his family came to the US, he had one brilliant start against the Mets, which he then followed with a 6 start, 5.82 ERA July, including his third terrible start of the year against the Red Sox....

2008-04-23 07:14:34
13.   Chyll Will
10 Really? should I start the list now? (Johnny Cash knew, and I concur. About EI, I must demur >;)
2008-04-23 07:21:58
14.   liam
6 9 the paul oneil thing was embarrassing, as a fan. surprisingly, it didnt seem that way to the people speaking.

i feel bad for hawkins, and it seems like you can tell that hes the type of pitcher that would be affected by this stuff. either that, or michael kay has said 'he's a nice guy' so many damn times that im convinced of it.

2008-04-23 07:25:28
15.   Shaun P
10 I called DirecTV last night, because I was ticked that the game wasn't available, and they said they were having technical difficulties with some of the EI channels. Sigh.

I don't think we had cats on campus, but the squirrels at Union always seemed particularly wild and frisky in the springtime when I was there (late 90s). But, they avoided the bushes and used tree branches instead. Something tells me that's one place not on Chyll's list (or Johnny Cash's either).

2008-04-23 07:29:53
16.   Sliced Bread
If A-Rod and wifey are taking baby name suggestions I offer Ruth.
Ruth Rodriguez. Now, there's a proud name.
No expectations to live up to there, kiddo!
2008-04-23 07:34:38
17.   Chyll Will
14 The unfortunate thing I suspect is that few people were willing to embrace Hawkins as a Yankee even before this crap, so it was easy to jump on him when he picked up that number and then had a terrible performance with it. This does not condone what the fans did, but it does expose some considerable ugliness about those fans and perhaps ourselves. How many of us are sympathizing with Hawkins now as a counter-reaction to fan and media response to an ultimately banal issue, considering how critical we've been of his presence right up to that moment?

O'Neill didn't exactly comport himself very well on the issue in my opinion, but it's kinda silly to expect someone who has been hailed as a "warrior" throughout and after his Yankee career to suddenly become magnanimous concerning a piece of his legacy. I'm taking a seat on this one, it's tabloid crap to pay the bills as far as I'm concerned.

2008-04-23 07:36:05
18.   dianagramr
Hat tip to Emma for the title reference :-)
2008-04-23 07:36:40
19.   Chyll Will
15 Wrong! I lived upstate too, remember... >;)
2008-04-23 07:48:57
20.   tommyl
11 Didn't Guidry do it in less starts?

Cliff, you need to update the sidebar I think. Isn't Javy going against Moose tonight? Who goes against Hughes tomorrow?

2008-04-23 07:49:59
21.   weeping for brunnhilde
16 Ruth Rodriguez.

You're my favorite dorkus, Sliced.

Ruth Rodriguez, indeed.

2008-04-23 07:51:31
22.   rbj
15 Thanks. I wondered why I could get some channels, such as Az, but not most of them.

13 It is my preferred location. ;-))

2008-04-23 07:55:59
23.   liam
17 jo - po has a piece on this today.. and alex belth is the #1 responder!

2008-04-23 08:00:26
24.   Raf
0 What's your excuse, Vazquez?

Maybe it's me, but given that he had a good 1/2 year, I'd have to say it was an injury of some sort. Something happened in July.

2008-04-23 08:09:41
25.   Chyll Will
23 Man, it's a good thing Alex got there first. No further comment...
2008-04-23 08:13:52
26.   mehmattski
20 Yeah, I saw that on PeteAbe's blog. ESPN was misinformed! Say it ain't so!
2008-04-23 08:18:48
27.   Zack
0 I don't know, I think the combination of the double negative (doesn't two black cats in the same sentence actually make it one white cat? Or perhaps its that the whole notion of a black cat/white cat binary is unstable and therefore invalid?), combined with their life affirming act, makes it actually a very fortuitous omen.

Any report on whether the black cat, upon running into the Yankee dugout, either immediately keeled over and died at the foot of Mike Mussina or jumped into the lap of Carl Pavano, forcing him to go into rehab for a "broken lap?"

2008-04-23 08:22:11
28.   mehmattski
27 As someone born on a Friday the Thirteenth, under a full moon, I don't feel as though I can comment.
2008-04-23 08:24:30
29.   Shaun P
24 Felipe Alou. Maybe Jeff Torberg. And Frank Robinson.

In 2000, Vazquez was 23, and threw 217.7 innings. He exceeded 110 pitches in 15 of his 33 starts.

In 2001, Vazquez was 24, and threw 223.7 innings. He exceeded 110 pitches in 14 of his 32 starts.

In 2002, Vazquez was 25, and threw 230.3 innings. He exceeded 110 pitches in 16 of his 34 starts.

In 2003, Vazquez was 26, and threw 230.7 innings. He exceeded 110 pitches in 19 of his 34 starts. 10 times he threw over 122 pitches. He led MLB in pitcher abuse points that year. Wood was second on the list; Prior fourth.

Maybe his arm was just a wee bit tired.

2008-04-23 08:31:17
30.   Chyll Will
27 doesn't two black cats in the same sentence actually make it one white cat?

Not in my neighborhood it doesn't... >;)

2008-04-23 08:34:20
31.   mehmattski
30 I was going for more of a genetics angle... black fur is typically a dominant gene, so you probably wouldn't end up with a white cat.

Then again, what if the two black cats were Wayne Brady and Barack Obama? White cats looooooooooove the two of them!

2008-04-23 08:43:43
32.   Mattpat11
Few thinks would give me as much pleasure as the Yankees pounding Vazquez into the ground tonight.

I'll be at the Nationals game though, so i won't see it.

2008-04-23 08:48:52
33.   williamnyy23
8 What I sense about Cone is a level of boredom and obligation in his voice when he is asked the obligatory, and ridiculously redundant, questions by Michael Kay. I don't know about anyone else, but I am sick and tired about hearing the same questions asked (e.g., "who has the advantage when a former battery faces each other?"), and it seems like Cone needs to muster some energy to answer them. Kay's tendency to ask these questions absolutely strangles the flow of the game and makes him a poor play-by-play man. He needs to stop turning the games into hit and run on Center Stage.
2008-04-23 08:51:46
34.   Bagel Boy
I can't believe Vazquez is only 31. I'd love to know if Boss, or the Tampa cabal, was pushing the buttons to get rid of specifically Jose and Javier. Seems like Cashman would have at least held onto them for one more year. Shoot, he'll have held onto Pavano for four years.
2008-04-23 08:53:41
35.   Chyll Will
31 Dave Chappelle might beg to differ with you about Wayne Brady:

2008-04-23 08:54:56
36.   horace-clarke-era
23 THANK you for this. I am now a late-to-the-party member of the JoPo Fan Club (depending what he thinks of Damon, mind you, and Roger on Steroids!). But for this, he's in the daily pantheon:

"Do you seriously find yourself struggling to imagine anyone ever being good enough to wear PAUL O'FREAKINGNEILL'S NUMBER? I mean, you had Ruth, Gehrig, DiMaggio, Mantle, Ford, Stengel, Reggie — throw Mattingly in there if you want — and you're really booing and ripping a guy trying to honor Clemente because it offends your PAUL O'NEILL SENSIBILITIES?

I'm just in awe. I am. And then I read that Jeter and others may be trying to get Paul O'Neill's number RETIRED? Has the world gone mad?"


Frankly, end of saga, or would be except for the excruciating stuff on air last night. "Thanks, guys!" KILLS me. And I do not think 'on the fence' is a legit position here, this is legacy and the proper assessment of it for a team that defines that. Being a warrior (which he was, though JoPo's funny as hell on that, too) doesn't excuse being delusional long after a career is over. O Neill could have and should have doused this.

I asked if anyone could ever wear #21 again, if it has been retired by beerheads. Someone said 'A Joba type.' But how do you START as a Joba type when you pick your number? And even if, say, a Sabathia came over (last night's version, please) is he going to be idiot enough to wade into THIS muck?

Nope. This sucks. JoPo nailed it.

2008-04-23 08:54:59
37.   williamnyy23
34 I don't remember one dissenting voice when the Yankees traded Vazquez for Randy Johnson. Besides, last year aside, Vazquez was only league average in his two other seasons since leaving the Yankees.
2008-04-23 08:59:51
38.   williamnyy23
36 I don't think Jo Po nailed it because his take assumes that most Yankee fans, or even a sizeable minority, want O'Neill's number retired. I don't think that's the case. Instead, I just think they don't care for Hawkins and therefore didn't want him to be the first to put #21 back in circulation.

I answered your question last time, and still maintain my response. Any popular home grown talent or quality free agent would not be booed for wearing #21. The bottom line is Hawkins (or any other journeyman reliever well known for being hammered by the Yankees) was going to be booed regardless...the #21 saga was just a convenient excuse.

2008-04-23 08:59:58
39.   Chyll Will
33 I agree with you, and that might make him a bad fit for the YES crew if they insist on playing to the casual or newbie fan. Perhaps he would be of better service in the organization (or any organization) as a coach or instructor. He has very good insights, but sticking him in the booth next to someone who plays to the lowest common denominator is bad programming in general, and poor vision by YES producers in particular.
2008-04-23 09:02:50
40.   mehmattski
35 I was referring to:

2008-04-23 09:04:53
41.   williamnyy23
39 Which raises the question, why exactly has Michael Kay been ordained Mr. YES? I honestly don't know many Yankee fans who really like him and he hardly received critical acclaim. It is bewildering to me that the Yankees continue to settle for subpar broadcasters on both radio and TV (although I do like many in the stable of analysts, particularly Singleton and Flaherty).
2008-04-23 09:06:43
42.   buffalocharlie
20 If only considering wins from game started, it took Guidry 86 starts to get 50 wins (in games in which he started). But, when Guidry got his 50th career win, he had less than 80 starts in the book as he had vultured some wins in relief. So the trivia question would need to be qualified.
2008-04-23 09:08:12
43.   buffalocharlie
41 I am not of fan of Michael Kay and would like to see him replaced.
2008-04-23 09:10:55
44.   Chyll Will
38 You almost have to wonder what was the clubhouse guy, who gave Hawkins No. 21 in the first place, thinking about. Isn't he traditionally the gatekeeper on such issues? Did he anticipate the reaction and try to warn him, or did he go along with it, chuckling to himself? I sincerely doubt the guy who gave it to him didn't know there would be a reaction, much less that type of reaction if he performed poorly...

Just to say, if there was an inkling that this would be an issue, why not nip it in the bud before it blew up into this crap, hmmmm?

2008-04-23 09:15:18
45.   williamnyy23
44 He actually gave it to Ensberg first, a man not honoring a baseball legend (even though Hawkins' tribute is somewhat dubious owing to his never having worn the number before). Ensberg ditched the number in Spring Training because he was already being mildly jeered for wearing it. Again, I am sure most fans were reacting to a "nobody" wearing #21, as opposed to being upset that the number was being recirculated.
2008-04-23 09:19:05
46.   Chyll Will
40 I know, but 35 was practically his reaction to 40 , which was definitely referred to at least twice in the skit. Considering what an incredible sport he is on other shows, it's wasn't the least bit surprising to me, but most certainly brilliant >;)
2008-04-23 09:28:30
47.   Chyll Will
45 But Hawkins is not a nobody to most Yankee fans, he was renown as a "loser" for the success the Yanks generally had against him throughout most of his career. I don't know enough personally about Hawkins to know that Clemente was a hero to him, but it struck me as a tad disingenuous when I first heard that being his reason. I dunno, maybe he is and it was coincidence to him, but then wouldn't the clubhouse guy (or Ensberg for that matter) have warned him about the reaction he got when he decided to give it back?

If Hawkins is really such a nice guy (and I believe he is), why would he have been so stubborn about wearing a number that has "universal" sentimentality attached to it, despite not being retired? And if you really want it retired, why not lobby for it after the first incident? I'm just not getting it...

2008-04-23 09:36:50
48.   williamnyy23
47 Whether the player is a loser of a nobody is irrelevant...I don't think either kind of player would be treated well if they decided to wear a beloved, but unretired number.

There really is no reason to lobby for #21 being retired because I don't think there is a strong sentiment to see it happen. I just maintain that most fans want the next #21 to be a quality player with plans to be in pinstripes longer than one season.

2008-04-23 09:51:08
49.   Chyll Will
48 I think there's a growing sentiment among Latino players to see 21 retired, but I won't argue the pros or cons. I do think you're right about the motive, otherwise they wouldn't have chanted. That said, would you let AJax wear it if he asks for it after a decent rookie season? Or, would you have let Cano wear it if he'd asked for it at any time?
2008-04-23 09:58:59
50.   Chyll Will
49 Or:

Frank Thomas
Mark Texeira
Josh Beckett (pre-RS)

Show/Hide Comments 51-100
2008-04-23 10:13:53
51.   williamnyy23
49 I don't think Cano or Ajax would have any problem wearing #21.
2008-04-23 10:28:20
52.   JL25and3
27 Or perhaps its that the whole notion of a black cat/white cat binary is unstable and therefore invalid?

Only if the cats belong to Dr. Schrodinger.

2008-04-23 10:28:20
53.   JL25and3
27 Or perhaps its that the whole notion of a black cat/white cat binary is unstable and therefore invalid?

Only if the cats belong to Dr. Schrodinger.

2008-04-23 10:29:37
54.   JL25and3
51 Which, to me, just underlines again how embarrassing the whole affair has been.
2008-04-23 10:31:18
55.   JL25and3
16 Given the attractive parents, there's a pretty good chance that Ruth Rodriguez would be a babe.
2008-04-23 10:37:37
56.   Knuckles
I wasn't an RJ fan but I also wasn't crying when Vazquez was dealt. The guy just didn't have whatever stud pitchers have that enables them to slam the door on a hitter. I'm probably looking at the past through poop colored glasses, but the guy was king of giving up a homer on an 0-2 count. Maybe someone with the B-R wizardry can see if that's borne out to be true.
2008-04-23 10:47:25
57.   weeping for brunnhilde
41 Why can't the Yanks' announcers be as good as the Mets'? That's my question.
2008-04-23 11:12:06
58.   JL25and3
56 The funny thing is, Vazquez was really good for half a season. Then he fell apart, and I still don't know why.

First half: 10-5, 3.56, 1.15 WHIP
Second half: 4-5, 6.92, 1.49 WHIP.

And to answer your other question:

On 0-2 counts - 69 PA, 3 HR, 23 K
After 0-2 count - 166 PA, 5 HR, 57 K

2008-04-23 11:26:00
59.   williamnyy23
54 To be embarassing would imply that the "issue" was as important as many have made it out to be. I personally don't think it was a big deal and therefore am not even remotely embarassed by it.
2008-04-23 11:29:15
60.   JL25and3
59 Well, you also thought O'Neill's reaction was rather warm and touching. We'll agree to disagree on this one.
2008-04-23 11:29:30
61.   Chyll Will
57 Differing objectives, perhaps. I don't suppose Gary Thorne is as high profile as Sterling/Kay, so he probably doesn't have the same mandates when he's on the air. The Wonder Twins (as in "I wonder why they're so important") are the faces of a media conglomerate, and their shtick is a natural and unfortunate part of that image.

It works the same way with bad music artists or music artists that have drifted away from their roots who continue to make processed cheese and still go multi-platinum. You play this crap over and over again until you accept it without condition. Neither Kay nor Sterling prevent people from watching or listening to the game, but if they started costing YES or WCBS advertisers, they'd be gone in less than 60 seconds. Such is not the case.

Look at it this way, Weep, there are a lot of programs, artists or other things that I would like to cancel forever, but I don't run the network yet. That's exactly why there's so much turmoil in the TV industry; one person who makes the decisions has a personal agenda that is often mutually exclusive from the fanbase, but the fans have no input unless they mobilize economically, which they rarely do.

2008-04-23 11:30:36
62.   Chyll Will
60 What? When did he say that?
2008-04-23 11:42:26
63.   weeping for brunnhilde
61 I'll look forward to the day when you do run the network, Will. Soon enough, I hope.

Maybe until then we should organize a week-long boycott of the radio broadcast. Or something.

God, they're just unlistenable. You don't even know what's going on in the game!


2008-04-23 11:43:14
64.   Raf
48 The sentiment to retire Clemente's number started shortly after Robinson's 42 was retired. I do remember hearing of a few players wearing #21 to honor Clemente (Sammy Sosa & Ruben Sierra come to mind) when I was younger.

56 I was thrilled when RJ was dealt here. I didn't mind giving up Vazquez for the best pitcher in the NL.

2008-04-23 11:44:41
65.   williamnyy23
60 That's a pretty extreme exaggeration of what I stated. I said it was refreshing to hear an athlete express his feelings honestly as opposed to couching them in jock speak. That's hardly "warm and touching" sentiment. I don't mind disagreeing as long as my position is stated accurately.
2008-04-23 11:46:47
66.   williamnyy23
64 Due to poor wording, my post 48 has been misunderstood. I meant to imply there was no ground swell to retire O'Neill's #21...not Clemente's.
2008-04-23 11:53:27
67.   Chyll Will
63 Do you honestly think they'd let me in the parking lot with what I have to say? I'll keep you posted... >;)
2008-04-23 11:58:03
68.   williamnyy23
63 You don't like the John Sterling Show with special guest stars, the New York Yankees?

Cut to Waldman in the wings..."Here'sssss Johnny!"

2008-04-23 12:09:35
69.   JL25and3
65 It is an exaggeration, for which I apologize - but I wasn't entirely making it up.

"I think that's genuine and human. It tells me he loved being a Yankee and was touched by the idea that they and the fans held in greet esteem. I not only don't have a problem with that, I am glad he feels that way."

So the "touched" sentiment is there, with your endorsement.

Having said that, I was allowing myself to get sarcastic, and that should really be directed at O'Neill rather than at you. My apologies.

2008-04-23 12:17:35
70.   a O
Farnsworth is a freaking joke. They'd be better off with a damn pitching machine out there grooving fastballs! When are they going to release this guy?
2008-04-23 13:05:35
71.   Rob Middletown CT
29 Oof. It all makes sense now...
2008-04-23 13:13:43
72.   Shaun P
56 58 See 29 .

71 Exactly. Over 900 innings in 4 years, and way too many high pitch counts, particularly as the innings kept going up. I'm sure that moving to the tougher league - no pitchers to face at the least - did not help Vazquez either.

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