Doc H hasn't been himself lately. Let's hope he doesn't rediscover his magic tonight. And that Pettitte throws a decent game!

A bunch of us said it last night, but Mo is just awesome. Stranding a lead-off trip - hope the rest of the 'pen was watching, cuz boys, that's how you do it.

What was Mo throwing at the end? The strikeout of Frank Thomas appeared to be a sinking fastball, and he threw another one to Overbay. I don't recall him ever throwing sinking fastballs. Singleton and Kay called it a two seam fastball, but Girardi called it a sinker.

New pitch, or two seam behaving differently than usual?

From Tyler (reposted from the last thread):

"Farnsie has the most experience doing that for the eighth and the ninth; he was a closer, too," Torre said. "I'd have to see something really bad from him where he was very inconsistent, and I haven't seen that."

Tommy and Shaun think Torre is hyping his value for a trade.

I look at the second part of that quote AND him using Farns for two consecutive close games in the 8th inning with very inconsistent results.

For a team that's trying to win every game, yup - that's the manager.

On a funny tip...When Matsui made that game saving catch, the YES broadcasters pointed out the older ladies watching him make that play through the window of the outfield wall. Then, Singleton comically pointed out one of the older ladies reaching her arms out as though she had a chance to catch the ball behind that wall. Dude...I don't know if anyone else caught this, but I could have sworn that older woman was an older guy with man boobs. Can anyone confirm on YES Encore???

As long as Torre continues to believe that Proctor and Farnsworth have big league talent, the playoffs are pure fantasy. Hmmm, they must have pictures of Joe with farm animals or something...

4 Those seats behind the left-field wall disgust me. The Yankees are always bragging about how "handicapped-accessible" the Stadium is. Well, that's the handicapped seating. So if you're in a wheelchair they'll stick you behind the left-field wall, a location worse than the worst seats in the house - but hey, they'll let you in, isn't that just wonderful of them?

5 I'm surprised that you think Proctor doesn't have big-league talent.

Jim -- I think you're incorrect on Farnsworth. He's been quite consistent.

Consistent s**t.

There is handicapped seating all over the ballpark and in many nice locations - check the map. I know - I briefly considered buying wheelchair "seats" (places to park said chair) right behind homeplate until my Dad convinced me morals are a good thing.

Yes, and I'll probably still burn in hell.

The first four innings took FOR-EVER last night, mostly on the count of Kei. At one point, I turned to Em and said, "Apparently, Igawa does a lot of running."

"Yeah?" she said. "He should try pitching." And she rolled her eyes.

Now, THAT brought a smile to my face.

3 Farnsworth has a very "consistent" 1.7 WHIP. With veterans you know what you're getting. There's a level of trust there. Doncha know?

When's the last time Edwarrior pitched? Is he even still on the team?

Don't forget all the handicapped seats in the bullpen.

12 Yes, but he has yet to make it onto the Wheel of Guts.

13 Nice.

Don't worry, we'll be bitching this time next year at Joe Girardi's stupid moves. 'Cause that's what we do!

Edwar's not an 8th inning guy. Check the label on the back of his jersey before you speculate on Torre's use of him. Check the labels, please!

Joe Girardi attended Northwestern. He's not stupid.

16 I don't know - it took me eight years to bitch about Torre. And a full eleven before I thought he HAD to go.

It'll be 8 GAMES (if that) before we're moaning about Little Joe.

10 Like a Baltimore game, huh? (I think it was OldYankeeFan who first pointed that out last night in the comments.)

12 Edwar currently sits in the Buddy Groom/Randy Choate Memorial "Last Guy in the Bullpen Who Torre Has Forgotten Exists" Chair. Andy Phillips used to sit in the dugout equivalent of the seat, the Kenny Lofton/Tony Womack Memorial "Last Guy on the Bench Who Torre Has Forgotten Exists" Spot. I believe its now occupied by Kevin Thompson.

11 Must . . . follow . . . formula . . .

Though in all seriousness, I feel certain Kyle is going to be traded away. Torre was pissed at him after the glove-throwing incident, and usually Torre is ticked when guys give up walks, doubles, and homers as frequently as Kyle has. But all we hear is how Kyle is fine. For all his blind spots, and his inability to learn, Torre isn't an idiot. Can you imagine if Torre called Farnsworth out in the media, or said how awful he's been? That would become a huge story, because Torre (almost)never does that, and then Farns really would be worthless.

I'm afraid we're stuck with Krazy Kyle in the 8th for a couple more weeks. Don't worry though, Krivsky or Gillick will give in soon enough.

10 I turned it off until Kei was out of the game (which, for better or worse, wasn't too far along). It was just too painful to watch. A very Wright-esque outing. I swear, if he threw one more pitch high and outside, I was gonna blow a gasket.

Really. I would have rather been mowing the lawn.

Regarding Farnsworth, if we could only be so lucky. I can't see anyone wanting him -- he has no value whatsoever (unless you count his value as a hard drinkin', glove throwin' moron).

Tony Womack was never the last guy on the bench. After they found out he couldn't hit MLB pitching, he became the starting CF.

Exactly -- the damn racist Torre had the gall to put him out in CF, for cryin' out loud.

21 Nah, Torre pitches Farns in back to back close games, in the 8th inning no less, because he's a genius.

Your logic got swallowed by your optimism.

25 Lofton does have a legit gripe though. It may not be racist in manner (though, who's to say for sure) but he would have been their best CF for 2004-2005 had Torre ever learned to trust him.

BTW: Doesn't context change everything? In 2004, Lofton had to fight Ruben and Tony Clark for playing time.

Now?

He'd be their leadoff hitter playing CF.

27 Lofton wasn't around in 2005; they traded him for Felix Rodriguez in the offseason.

26 I didn't say Torre wasn't stupid, I just said he wasn't an idiot. Stupid is pitching Farnsworth back-to-back - though it does make him unavailable for a couple of days, allowing Torre to try someone else in the 8th inning role, so who knows?

Idiotic is going completely out of character in front of the New York media.

24 Tony Womack got 65 ABs in June 2005; if he was starting, that means he started, say, 16 games (figure 4 AB/game). (OK, I just looked it up - in June, he started 14 times in LF, and 3 times in CF, all at the end of the month, on 6/26, 6/27, and 6/28. So I was off by 1 game.) Then he got 79 ABs the rest of the year. So yeah, he rode the bench.

23 Wayne Krivsky, based on his track record, is foolish enough to value Farnsworth as a "C"loser. Pat Gillick is desperate, because the Phillies have no one in the bullpen.

10 Alex, you have definitely found a winner. My gf isn't too into baseball yet, but she's learning. She'll occasionally text me with score updates every so often, though she does have an unhealthy crush on Damon. Was Em into the Yankees as much when you guys got together?

Hideki Matsui, last 11 games (hitting streak):

50 PA, .364/.440/.864 6 HR 4 2B

Just thought I'd share. The rumors of Godzirra's demise were greatly exaggerated.

29 Right. Who was the CF in 2005?

Otherwise, I was just saying the Memorial Chair shouldn't be named after Lofton or Womack - for different reasons.

5 Proctor is a perfectly good middle reliever. You cannot expect every single guy out of the pen to be Mariano Rivera. For the most part Proctor pitches well and doesn't allow a lot of baserunners, what's more he can get a K if he needs it when runners are in scoring position.

Sure, once every so often he has a bad game or two, but that's why he's a middle reliever and not a frontline starter. I don't think he's the closer of the future but I'm fine seeing him in low to mid leverage situations.

Farnsworth is a different story. He is usually so inconsistent that he'll be good for one batter and then start making Posada get out of his crouch the next. Looking at him, I think he's either too dumb, or too lazy to really work on his mechanics. If he could get them repeatable, and have even average command he'd be lights out. It really is a shame. Even Rivera is hittable when his command goes south, like that triple last night. I know everyone always talks about the freakish movement of Mo's cutter, but I've always thought what made him great was his control and command. He can hit a quarter with it every time, and Mo was great even before the cutter (see '96).

31 A fine topic!

Bobby Abreu - July:
48 PA - .386 .396 .682

Melky Cabrera - July:
57 PA - .365 .389 .442

Robby Cano - July:
51 PA - .298 .333 .596

Miguel Cairo - July:
21 PA (after 73 in June)

34

Bobby Abreu - July:
48 PA - .386 .396 .682
$16,000,000/year

Melky Cabrera - July:
57 PA - .365 .389 .442
$432,000/year

Robby Cano - July:
51 PA - .298 .333 .596
$490,000/year

Miguel Cairo - July:
21 PA (after 73 in June)
Priceless!

34 Don't forget:

Jorge Posada
52 PA .326/.442/.488

Derek Jeter
62 PA .333/.387/.539

Andy Phillips
43 PA .375/.419/.500

So... pretty much everyone except A-Rod (who still has 4 HR in 54 AB)... and... ahem... Damon (.188/.344/.208), who would be completely useless if he couldn't still draw the occasional walk.

Bernie Williams played most of the time in CF in 05.

OPS in 2007: Johnny Damon .671, Doug Mientaskd;aklsd .671

Of course, at least Damon is beating out Wil Nieves (.319 OPS).

27 It may not be racist in manner (though, who's to say for sure) but he would have been their best CF for 2004-2005 had Torre ever learned to trust him.

OK, we'll never know for sure. But Lofton did start 62 games in CF. The other CFG starts: Bernie 93, Crosby 5, Matsui 2. That doesn't look too racially informed, unless Bernie is "not all black" on the Sheffield pigment scale.

Oh yeah, Bernie outhit Lofton in 2004, though it's dobtful that his slight advantage on offense made up for his truly atrocious defense.

37 And when he didn't "play"? Or who was the CF in Game 5 of the ALDS?

36 Actually, we'll have to see what Andy does in August, but we may just have to name that the "Andy Phillips Memorial Chair".

After all, he did have a .333 .347 .623 line in 72 PA of June 06. He followed that up with a .165 .208 .275 line in 96 PA of July. That earned him 28 PA the rest of the season.

Of course, Bernie isn't all black -- he's Puerto Rican. Just like when C.C. Sabathia said Jose Reyes and Carlos Delgado aren't black.

If these guys aren't black, I'm not sure who is. But, this is Gary Sheffield and his little fantasy world of "the white man keepin' him down."

40 Yep. I love the Andy Phillips story, but he does seem to have that big swing that ML pitchers can exploit, and his admittedly very limited track record suggests that he might be very prone to extreme streakiness. Let's hope not this year.

41 I'm sick of this Torre racist stuff. The guy didn't like Kenny Lofton, maybe he should have but I doubt its because he's black. Say whatever you want about Torre's managing and such (Lord knows that I do) but as a person I have the utmost respect for him. He's been nothing but stand up and anyone that lets Tony Womack play LF cannot be racist. That's more than affirmative action there.

Remember that Dandy Andy is 30 years old. Let's not forget that. He's not some kid. This is his ceiling, folks. Useful part time player, but over-exposure is a real possibility.

38 The batting-title qualified players with a lower OPS than Johnny Damon in the AL:

Alex Gordon
Yuniesky Betancourt
Jason Bartlett
Craig Monroe
Corey Patterson
Tony Pena Jr
Juan Uribe
Josh Barfield
Bobby Crosby
Nick Punto
Julio Lugo
Jason Kendall

With Kendall now out of the league, that puts Damon in the 13th percentile!

39 Bernie (who's Latino :) should have been the DH in 2004. Having Big Rube on the roster had a certain way of obfuscating things for Torre. And Lofton was an equivalent hitter as Rube but an above average CF. Suffice it to say, if Torre played it right, Lofton is the CF in 2004-2005 while Bernie is the DH. Indeed, that arrangement may have lasted through last year too.

44 Fair enough, but we don't really know what his ceiling is (or was two years ago), because he's never been given enough consitent playing time to establish a baseline. His MiL numbers suggest that he should hit somehwere in this ballpark over the long haul, but his doubters make good points.

46 No argument here. I was just pointing out that Lofton's racism claims appear baseless, at least when one looks at the distribution of playing time. Hmmm...maybe Lofton would argue that Torre favors Latinos over African-Americans (ie, those who are "all black" on the Sheffield scale)? really, the whole discussion strikes me as silly at best, distateful at worst.

43 "anyone that lets Tony Womack play LF cannot be racist"

Indeed, that might be the most damning evidence against the claim! Where's the media with that story?

"Tony, did you think Torre was racist when he put you in the OF while hitting .240 and slugging .280?"

Well, Andy has 350 major league AB, so we have some basis here -- .240 average, 10 HR, 44 RBI, 80K, 20 BB, .282 OBP, .400 SLG, OPS+ of 78 (below Damon this year).

So, to me, this is a pinch hitter against lefties. That's about it.

45 Gordon will pass him soon (.672 vs .671).

That is awful company for Damon to be in. A bunch of no hit middlde infielders, a guy who at least has some power (Monroe), and Corey Patterson. Remember when Damon was a free agent, and Boras was touting his numbers and what he was on pace to do (like 3000 hits, 2000 runs, etc)? Yeah, I don't think Damon is going to reach those, Scott.

I feel bad for whoever falls for Boras's "Andruw Jones is the new Willie Mays" booklet, coming to a Hot Stove near year this offseason.

I don't pretend to have any idea what Sheffield is talking about, or even any idea what it's like to feel singled out because of the color of my skin. And while I'm in no way defending Sheffield, he did specifically say later in the interview that Torre is "not a racist." So I'm sure that there's something else going on there.

In the context of Sheffield's earlier comments about the difference between Latino players and black players, is the only context in which Sheff's comments make sense. He's making a point that he felt that American blacks were treated differently than American whites and Latino blacks. He was not labelling anyone a racist.

In the end though, my WASPy nature technically forbids me from even entering these dicussions, so I'll bow out while I feel I'm still making a bit of sense.

50 But many of those ABs where in part time duty and under a ton of pressure. He's always mashed at the AAA level, I'd like to see what he can do with an extended run of consistent playing time (i.e. not benched when he hits the inevitable slump).

47 See June and July of last year. That was as consistent as you can get. And the average of the two month was about a .700 OPS.

Hey, I'm not complaining - He's the best option they have right now and he's better than Hillenbrand. But I wouldn't be against Dmitri or Hatteberg either.

Otherwise, the next Andy slump means significant playing time for Cairo then Mghjk.

54

I'd rather watch Andy play through a slump than watch Cairo or Hillenbrand suck.

Dimitri Young is an interesting possibility, but he's not young, he's injured (a lot), and he has a pretty atrocious home/away split.

If they could get him cheap, then I wouldn't care much, but I don't think he's worth a lot in a trade to maybe outhit Andy by a little.

Anyone seen Joba's last 2 starts at Trenton?

13 IP, 7 H, 0 ER, 2 BB, 21 K

He and Ian are the future of this team.

(Hopefully not as Bill Pulsipher, Paul Wilson, and Jason Isringhausen were for the Mess.)

53 I agree. I usually don't say this, but I think you have to take the human element into account here. How does a person learn to hit major league pitching when he's jerked around like Andy has been? He doesn't. The only time he got consistent playing time, he crushed the league in June '06, then (no surprise) the league crushed back in July '06 . . . and then Andy never got time to make any further adjustments. I don't think we can judge him based off his major league numbers yet.

Where's weeping - he'd be so proud of me, bringing in the human element and all that. =)

52 I thought Tyler Kepner had a very informative take on Sheffield in this blog post:

http://tinyurl.com/3e3dm3

I think our resident Sheffield "expert", JL25and3, would agree with Mr. Kepner's assessment. That's good enough to end it for me.

But, Andy will never get a chance to work through an extended slump. If he goes 1-for-20, his butt's back on the bench. Torre doesn't let guys ride through slumps (unless they're dreadful middle relievers, then all bets are off).

From a Yankee hater:

Eddie (Hoboken, NJ): In your respected opinion, do you see the Yankees as being buyers or sellers at the deadline? If this were any other team 8 games back of the WC, would we even have this discussion?

SportsNation Rob Neyer: (12:24 PM ET ) Buyers. The Yankees have the third-best run differential in the American League, and they might actually be the third-best team in the majors.

9 Jim, almost all of the rest of the handicapped seating os located all the way in the back of the lower deck - really, in little extra areas tacked on to the inside concourse. A few of those areas are in decent locations - behind home plate, even - but they still provide extremely poor, obstructed views. They are in no way comparable to any other seats in the stadium.

58 Kepner went easy on him. But yes, he's complained about racist treatment since Milwaukee. He's always got someone else to blame.

Another typical Sheffield move is to say something that has a plain meaning, and then deny that he meant that. He says he threw balls away in Milwaukee, then gets outraged - how could people believe he threw balls away in Milwaukee???

So I think it's disingenuous for him to say that he didn't call Torre a racist. He didn't use the word, no. But he essentially said that Torre looks like a duck, walks like a duck and quacks like a duck. So come on, how could you ever think that he was calling Torre a duck?

All I know is it was easier and cheaper to get lower level handicapped "seats" (and not the concourse ones) than real seats in the same sections. I just needed to bring my own chair.

And:
http://newyork.yankees.mlb.com/nyy/ballpark/seating_pricing.jsp

Shows there's plenty of good options. Again, research is your friend.

62 I don't know, the chart for which JD supplied a link 63 indicates that there are handicapped accessible locations throughout much of the lower and loge decks, and locations in the blachers, not all of which are in the back tacked onto the concourse. Then again, these are after all handicapped accessible seats--is it possible for them to be completely comparable to all of the other stadium seats, given the particular needs and requirements to all a seat to be accessible? This is also a product of a stadium designed in the 1920s and remodelled in the early 1970s (but keeping much of the same seating layout). The structure was never built with handicapped accessible seats in mind.

I am more than willing to bitch about Yankee corporate greed and propaganda, but they seem to have done a decent job by adding so much handicapped accessible seating over the last few years.

63 Hm, do I detect a hint of condescension?

All of the seats that are not in the outfield - and most of those that are - are exactly as I've described. I've not only looked at the seating chart, I've looked at the seats. Have you? Oh, I'm sorry, all you know is that they're cheaper and available. Try taking a look at them.

I don't know about the seats in the RF bleachers, nor about the ones that are at the center aisle in the outfield. Perhaps those are better, though at best they're merely bad seats (as are all field level seats out there).

64 Yeah, they kind of need to be roughly comparable. What they've done certainly isn't anything to brag about. Whatever those outfield seats are, I'm willing to bet that they're put in areas where the Yankees couldn't put real paying seats - that's what they've done in the rest of the Stadium.

But yeah, those handicapped people are so lucky. They get to buy cheap, lousy, available seats just by bringing their own chair. They get good parking spaces, too. Damn, I wish I were so lucky - though you're right, I could pretend. Lovely idea.

Btw, I did do a little more research. The only reason they provided more seats at all was that they were being sued.

However, they are definitely going about designing the new Stadium correctly, and I give them credit for that. They're working with disabled advocacy groups to make sure that there are not only good seats, but that more subtle and detailed accomodations. For instance, the seats are being elevated enough so that the handicapped will be able to see Mo throw strike three - when everyone else is standing. There will also be electrical outlets, so medical equipment can be plugged in.

That, they can brag about. That's really good work.

65 "I'm willing to bet that they're put in areas where the Yankees couldn't put real paying seats..."

You'd lose that bet--the team could sell just about any seat, anywhere right now. Frankly, when I go a game these days, I have to buy a crappy seat because I'm not a season ticket holder and/or won't shell out $60 or $70 (or more) to see a ball game. So to my eye, the crappy seats are comparable.

You seem very angry today.

54 Didn't Phillips's wife have cancer and lose a pregnancy around that time?