Baseball Toaster Bronx Banter
The Toronto Blue Jays
2007-07-16 12:52
by Cliff Corcoran
Note: The Bronx Banter blog has moved to

The Yankees did what they needed to do by taking three of four from the Devil Rays over the weekend. They'll now need to do the same against the Blue Jays at home this week. The Jays are the toughest opponent the Yankees will face until they head to Cleveland on August 10 and they'll face them seven times prior to that date, adding a three-game set in Toronto to wrap up the cupcake portion of their schedule in the first week of August.

The Blue Jays, who have gotten Roy Halladay, Greg Zaun and Reed Johnson back from the DL since the Yankees last saw them in late May, have played well of late. They opened the second half by splitting a four-game set in Boston and concluded the first half by taking four of six from the Indians and A's. That said, the Jays are the definition of a .500 team (a game below in reality, a game above according to Pythagoras), while the Yankees are desperately trying to prove that they're more than that. In that way, this could prove to be a huge series for the Bombers.

The Blue Jays hold a 3-1 advantage in the season series entering tonight having beaten Phil Hughes in his major league debut in a rain-shortened one-game series in the Bronx in April and taken two of three in the "Rod Said 'Ha!'" series in late May. Of course, the Yankees' starting pitchers in those four games were Hughes in his debut, Matt DeSalvo, Andy Pettitte, and Tyler Clippard, so the Blue Jays have yet to really face the Yankees' best.

Not that they will tonight either. Kei Igawa takes the mound in his fourth start since returning from the minors. In his first three he's posted a 6.19 ERA while walking nine and allowing three home runs in 16 innings (all three dingers coming in the middle start against the A's). The Yanks will have to outhit whatever Igawa gives them tonight and will look to do so against Josh Towers. Towers' last start (on July 8) was far and away his best of the season as he held the Indians scoreless on three hits and no walks over eight innings. He was nearly as good against the Tigers back on April 15, but otherwise has been more of a five-inning, four-run starter. He won't walk very many, but he'll give up his share of hits and homers. The Yankees have only faced Towers in relief this year, plating a run against him in 2 2/3 innings in their only win over the Jays on the season.

Toronto Blue Jays

2007 Record: 45-46 (.495)
2007 Pythagorean Record: 46-45 (.511)

Manager: John Gibbons
General Manager: J. P. Riccardi

Home Ballpark (2007 Park Factors): Rogers Centre (103/103)

Who's Replacing Whom?

Reed Johnson (DL) replaces Adam Lind (minors) on the roster and Matt Stairs in left field
Greg Zaun (DL) replaces Sal Fasano (minors) on the roster and Jason Phillips behind the plate
Roy Halladay (DL) replaces A. J. Burnett (DL)
Brandon League replaces Josh Towers in the bullpen
Josh Towers replaces Tomo Ohka in the rotation

25-man Roster:

1B – Lyle Overbay (L)
2B – Aaron Hill (R)
SS – John McDonald (R)
3B – Troy Glaus (R)
C – Gregg Zaun (S)
RF – Alex Rios (R)
CF – Vernon Wells (R)
LF – Reed Johnson (R)
DH – Frank Thomas (R)


L – Matt Stairs (OF/1B)
R – Royce Clayton (IF)
L – Howie Clark (IF)
R – Jason Phillips (C)


R – Roy Halladay
R – Shaun Marcum
R - Dustin McGowan
R - Jesse Litsch
R – Josh Towers


R – Jeremy Accardo
R – Jason Frasor
L – Scott Downs
R – Casey Janssen
R – Brandon League
L – Brian Tallet
R - Brian Wolf

15-day DL: R – A. J. Burnett, L – Gustavo Chacin
60-day DL: L – B. J. Ryan, L – Davis Romero

Typical Lineup:

R – Vernon Wells (CF)
R - Reed Johnson (LF)
R – Alex Rios (RF)
R – Frank Thomas (DH)
R - Troy Glaus (3B)
L – Lyle Overbay (1B)
R – Aaron Hill (2B)
S - Gregg Zaun (C)
R - John McDonald (SS)

Comments (279)
Show/Hide Comments 1-50
2007-07-16 13:02:36
1.   mehmattski
Leaving out his first start back (7 IP, no runs on 6 hits, 7 K), Halladay in his last 8 starts:

5-2 49.1 IP 63 H, 14 BB, 25 K, 5 HR, 5.66 ERA

Have the wheels finally fallen off for the oft-injured ace?

2007-07-16 13:14:00
2.   rilkefan
0 "Rod Said 'Ha!'" - pure genius.
2007-07-16 13:43:17
3.   tommyl
2007-07-16 14:23:53
4.   rilkefan
3 Hey, guess you missed my comment on the old thread hassling you about wanting to see the LHC data.
2007-07-16 14:29:48
5.   tommyl
4 I did, what did you say?
2007-07-16 14:38:42
6.   rilkefan

Basically it's not interpretable outside a monstrous analysis framework.

2007-07-16 15:01:43
7.   yankz
Ah, the Hughes debut...I was there, it was a much more hopeful time. Then the entire season came crashing down.
2007-07-16 15:25:30
8.   mehmattski
Has anybody seen the MySpace blog co-written by Mike Pagliaruo? Jim Dean would particularly enjoy their analysis of Brian Cashman:

Frankly, any analysis of Cashman that rates Ron Villone as the best move of the 2006 off-season (above Pettitte? wtf?) is sorely misguided. Also they seem to ignore statistics in favor of making fun of a pitchers' weight. Very classy. I will not be reading further.

2007-07-16 15:32:08
9.   cult of basebaal
8 heh. yeah, saw that webpage too, and thought just about the same thoughts (guess pags didn't get the "we're not here to sell jeans" memo from a few years back) ... didn't post a link though, since i figured that would probably tantamount to screaming "beetlejuice" three times loudly ...
2007-07-16 15:46:37
10.   mehmattski
9 Fair enough. I would have gone for yelling "fire" in a crowded theatre.

Then again, I don't think there's much disagreement here that the moves for Igawa and Minky deserve an F.

2007-07-16 16:00:33
11.   standuptriple
Pags should stick to his day job, whatever the hell that is. Villone? You're going to put your name on Villone? Ok, just giving you one last chance to back out of that.
2007-07-16 16:03:42
12.   Jim Dean
8 Funny enough, they're evaluating value and on that scale 32 million is very overpriced for what Pettitte has given them.

10 And seriously, where else have you seen a former player call the Minky deal exactly what it was.

Overall, I thought it was pretty decent analysis, from a former player. Except the Unit trade is a big fat F.

2007-07-16 16:04:57
13.   mehmattski
11 Also, who thought MySpace would be a good idea? Blogs are partly successful because people can check them at work... so let's start one on a site that is blocked by almost every company with a filter...
2007-07-16 16:09:01
14.   Marcus
13 I was thinking the same thing. If you want to be taken seriously as a baseball analyst...I would think it would go without saying that you would avoid myspace as the website for your blog.
2007-07-16 16:13:50
15.   mehmattski
12 This wins the Least Surprising Comment Award :-)

Still, if it were up to Pags, the Padres signing David Wells and the Indians drafting C.C. Sabathia in the first round would both get an F. Not to mention Roberto Hernandez, Bob Wickman, and Bartolo Colon, just to name a few portly fellows from the ERA Top 50 of active pitchers...

2007-07-16 16:17:58
16.   Shaun P
11 Whoops. I believe Pags's day job is with a company he owns that does analysis and scouting of international players, though I can't get their website to load up:

(Thanks, Steve!)

2007-07-16 16:19:23
17.   Shaun P
Is no one but me watching?
2007-07-16 16:19:43
18.   mehmattski
Kei Igawa: More outs than baserunners (barely)!

Much better than his last start...

2007-07-16 16:21:32
19.   Shaun P
18 If we're the only two guys here, and we're pulling a seamus and RIYank, I call being RIYank. =)

I wonder how effective Igawa will be out of the bullpen when the time comes? His homer and walk tendencies while starting are troubling. But maybe those disappear in (short) relief?

2007-07-16 16:21:51
20.   fansince77
Igawa can't get out big hitters in the big leagues- it's too hard every time. Even though he got out of this inning- when are the Yanks going to wise up and see that he is just too dangerous out there for five innings with no out if he could develop a nasty curve ball I could see him being an excellent middle relief guy- 2 or 3 innings. But this is not the spot for him with so much young talent waiting for the fifth spot.
2007-07-16 16:25:27
21.   Shaun P
20 I think Igawa is clearly a place-holder until Hughes returns, so I wouldn't worry.

Meanwhile, when will common sense prevail and Johnny Damon be sent to the DL, his pride be damned? Amazing that Joe Torre, the same guy who once had the cohones to bench Wade Boggs, because he thought it was best for the team, now won't make Damon do what's best for the team. So frustrating.

2007-07-16 16:33:00
22.   fansince77
21 agreed and understand about the place holding but we need EVERY win. There are many other options besides Igawa.
2007-07-16 16:43:34
23.   fansince77
this is where it may get ugly.
2007-07-16 16:44:38
24.   mehmattski
Six outs, five baserunners. Riveting.
2007-07-16 16:45:02
25.   nyyfan22
whew... That was a great break for the yanks.
2007-07-16 16:46:31
26.   randym77
Igawa living dangerously. As usual.
2007-07-16 16:47:07
27.   Yankees Brasil
24 Nice WHIP for the game!
2007-07-16 16:47:44
28.   mehmattski
2007-07-16 16:48:10
29.   cult of basebaal
beetlejuice, beetlejuice, beetlejuice ... 12 ... AAAAAHH! It's TRUE!!!
2007-07-16 16:48:31
30.   cult of basebaal
2007-07-16 16:49:07
31.   mehmattski
The guy who caught Matsui's homer had a USA Baseball Damon jersey, and looked like Red Sox era Damon.
2007-07-16 16:49:11
32.   nyyfan22
7 more runs and I'll breathe again.
2007-07-16 16:49:44
33.   Yankees Brasil
2007-07-16 16:50:43
34.   seattleyank
I wonder how many pitches it would take Igawa to get through 9 innings? 200? 300? 350?
2007-07-16 16:52:49
35.   cult of basebaal
2007-07-16 16:53:13
36.   nyyfan22
34 Naa, you don't wanna start thinking that deep. Next thing you know you'll be wandering around SEA-TAC with no mental faculties left.
2007-07-16 16:53:26
37.   mehmattski
Clifs' Headline Tomorrow:

Faulty Towers.

2007-07-16 16:55:38
38.   Yankees Brasil
Some hard hit balls
2007-07-16 16:56:56
39.   OldYanksFan
I thought there were 2 interesting thing from Pags-aillo-brillo.
1) [Cashmans] Made the team worse by attempting to do too many things; build the minor league system and compete in the division. Nobody does both unless the minor league farm system is already built.

2)The Yankees chose not to use his Japan consultants, who have told him to walk away from Igawa. The consultants knew about the Igawa hold-out in spring training 2005 in Japan, and how Igawa's manager slapped him for not playing during spring training after the team had won the NPB championship. Igawa then laid down that year and wasn't productive at all. Important information that is interpreted through consulting and difficult to put on scouting reports.

If #1 is true, then Cashman was between Rock-and-hardplace, as our Farm issues HAD to be addressed. As our team aged and our farm floundered, our future was extremely shakey.

If #2 is true, then I am disappointed in MyMan Cash. I'd value my own peoples view, but the Japanese can't be ignored. I wonder what was said and how the Yankees took it.

I had faith in Iggy, but he is bumming me. He should have a sign around his neck warning off people with weak hearts. 7 more bombs from the Yankees and I can relax.

2007-07-16 16:57:03
40.   seattleyank
36 Good point.
2007-07-16 16:57:25
41.   cult of basebaal
37 a few more bombs, it might be "tower-ing inferno"
2007-07-16 17:01:16
42.   OldYanksFan
31 That 'guy' was a girl. Boston bred.
2007-07-16 17:02:32
43.   OldYanksFan
Just a matter of time. You're right. No out pitch. Both runners were 0-2.
2007-07-16 17:02:42
44.   fansince77
anyone suprised...anyone? Always 0-2 with no good results. That's just plain bad.
2007-07-16 17:03:15
45.   Yankees Brasil
Cant be effective without an out-pitch
2007-07-16 17:04:53
46.   fansince77
btw - in Igawa's defense Wells was so struck out. That was an inexusable non-call by the umpire
2007-07-16 17:05:20
47.   Yankees Brasil
That same pitch to Thomas was called a ball to Wells
2007-07-16 17:08:19
48.   OldYanksFan
The pitch to Wells was a strike. The pitch to Thomas was 6" inside. I think its time to 'computerize' the strike zone, and just let the umps call balls in play.
2007-07-16 17:08:34
49.   mehmattski
Nine outs, seven baserunners.

It's gonna be down to the wire, folks.

2007-07-16 17:10:25
50.   Yankees Brasil
Damon is really bad this year.. only Joe doesnt see it
Show/Hide Comments 51-100
2007-07-16 17:14:15
51.   mehmattski
Man, he makes it look easy.

Four more till 500.

2007-07-16 17:14:48
52.   yankz
Good Ol' Coddemeyer.
2007-07-16 17:15:05
53.   fansince77
How important was Abreu's hustle...the little things
2007-07-16 17:15:06
54.   fansince77
How important was Abreu's hustle...the little things
2007-07-16 17:15:19
55.   Yankees Brasil
2007-07-16 17:15:45
56.   yankz
You listening, Jose Reyes?
2007-07-16 17:16:33
57.   fansince77
OK - can we get Igawa out of there now? Let's see how many 3 ball counts he goes this inning.
2007-07-16 17:20:51
58.   mehmattski
Pasta Divingjeter!
2007-07-16 17:21:01
59.   williamnyy23
The Igawa saga continues...I'm convinced...he can't pitch. I wonder if the Yankees could work out a deal with a Japanese team in which they pick up a portion of his salary and receive some sake in return.
2007-07-16 17:26:06
60.   Shaun P
58 Ummmm . . . pasta.

48 I have been arguing with friends and family to 'computerize' the strike zone for over five years. No one has ever agreed with me.

Doing it would be reasonably easy too. Its a two-dimensional problem in three-dimensional space, and one of the dimensions (overheard/ over the plate) is (in theory) easy. Suspend a high-resolution camera directly over the plate, and write some software that will analyze the video feed in real time to see whether the ball catches any part of the plate or not. Shouldn't be too hard.

That's as far as I've gotten in figuring it out. =)

2007-07-16 17:27:25
61.   yankz
That's nothing; remember the guy on the O's a couple years back that got the W without throwing a single pitch?
2007-07-16 17:28:54
62.   Shaun P
39 Wait. So Cashman chooses to not use Pags's services, and then Pags's "analysis" of Cashman concludes he's done a poor job? You're kidding.

I'm as shocked by that as I am that Steve Phillips believes the Braves are going to catch the Mets in the NL East, and that the Mets won't make the playoffs. Wow Steve, you think the team that fired you is going to do poorly? Who woulda thunk it?

2007-07-16 17:29:46
63.   tommyl
6 Well, I didn't mean the raw, raw data, but they aren't planning on releasing things before they come in to the black box. For a take on what theorists could do with some data, check out the LHC Olympics:

Sorry for the delayed reply, just got in from my soccer game. Igawa is actually pitching?

I see A-Rod homered, ho hum. Another day, another dollar.

2007-07-16 17:29:50
64.   mehmattski
AFLAC trivia answer: Gabe White. He's actually had two wins with only one pitch, and his other one-pitch win is also the last one pitch, 2/3 inning win.
2007-07-16 17:30:54
65.   tommyl
Oh wait, I now see he is over 90 pitches in the 4th inning. Wow, that's bad. Phil Hughes, please hurry back.
2007-07-16 17:31:09
66.   JeremyM
Why not just bring in someone now, Igawa is finished. He should be gone after this inning anyway, so what difference does it make to the bullpen?
2007-07-16 17:32:37
67.   fansince77
playing Russian roulette.
2007-07-16 17:32:42
68.   mehmattski
Twelve outs. Nine baserunners. This may be premature, but I think outs is going to win.
2007-07-16 17:33:54
69.   seattleyank
I say bring Igawa back out for the next inning. I figure he is due--just out of sheer, dumb luck--for a 1-2-3 inning. I mean, even Farnsy had one a couple weeks ago.
2007-07-16 17:44:39
70.   yankz
What deal were they talking about? It got cut off on Something about the A's?
2007-07-16 17:45:35
71.   weeping for brunnhilde
Of course.
2007-07-16 17:46:26
72.   weeping for brunnhilde
I hate that Troy Glaus. He killed us with California.
2007-07-16 17:46:32
73.   Shaun P
70 Dan Johnson? Or Piazza? (I'm Gamedaying it.)

Oh, now I'm excited. Can you imagine Piazza as the Yanks' DH? (Finally?! How many of us here called for this two years ago?!) Mets' fans would be ticked off, I imagine.

2007-07-16 17:46:39
74.   yankz
Boston owes Igawa a nice fruit basket or something.
2007-07-16 17:47:06
75.   mehmattski
Did Kay just say that Proctor is not available tonight? His arm is still attached, correct? I don't understand!
2007-07-16 17:47:36
76.   Yankees Brasil
70 Kendal to the Cubs
2007-07-16 17:47:41
77.   fansince77
Shocking! - a two strike pitch up and middle. Well done Joe Torre - for leaving Igawa in there for the inevitable. Igawa is not good. I don't hate the guy but he doesn't have major league stuff.

Everyone on this site knew this was going to happen. Why didn't Joe, Gator, anyone else?

2007-07-16 17:47:46
78.   cult of basebaal
well ... at least we might see edwar tonite ... course, with 10 days off, who wants to be he won't be sharp
2007-07-16 17:47:53
79.   williamnyy23
The presence of guys like Igawa makes it very hard for me to believe that this organization understands the urgency of their situation.
2007-07-16 17:48:02
80.   weeping for brunnhilde
Can't we just pull him now?

Ok, let's say that if he can get through this inning having allowed two or fewer runs, we count our blessings.

2007-07-16 17:48:09
81.   mehmattski
73 Easy there... the deal was Kendall to the Cubs for Sean Marshall, who I know nothing about except that he's not the same guy who was drafted by the Nets two weeks ago...
2007-07-16 17:48:10
82.   Shaun P
72 There is a subset of Yankee fans, mostly younger ones I think, who hate the Angels far more than they hate the Red Sox.

I can understand that.

Gee, this is where the long guy in the bullpen would be useful. OK, call for Villon . . . whoops. Joe used him yesterday!

2007-07-16 17:48:29
83.   Maniakes
I'm confused. I thought the home run derby was last week.
2007-07-16 17:48:35
84.   cult of basebaal
76 now that's how you cut bait ...
2007-07-16 17:48:42
85.   fansince77
Last three balls- 390 +. What must the Yankee position players be thinking right now? How many runs will we have to put up?
2007-07-16 17:49:27
86.   weeping for brunnhilde
80 That's two or fewer runs over and above the first one, of course.
2007-07-16 17:50:35
87.   cult of basebaal
i wonder what gator could possibly say to igawa during these pitching visits?
2007-07-16 17:50:59
88.   Shaun P
81 Ahh, shoot. That's interesting, in a baseball fan sense - not such much as a Yankee fan, though.

I suppose Beane will take anything to get rid of Kendall . . . is this a done deal, or a rumor?

2007-07-16 17:51:06
89.   weeping for brunnhilde
Nice job, Igawa.

Thanks for swinging, Hill!

2007-07-16 17:51:10
90.   Maniakes
87, "Throw better pitches".
2007-07-16 17:51:53
91.   fansince77
OK-end on a strikeout. GETHIMOUTOFTHERE!
2007-07-16 17:51:59
92.   Shaun P
87 Either something that sounds soothing, or a lot of curse words. I'd probably be cursing.
2007-07-16 17:52:00
93.   Yankees Brasil
88Not a done deal yet
2007-07-16 17:52:36
94.   cult of basebaal
88 done deal according to the catfish stew link ...boy the cubs sure did fuck themselves over with their spite trade of barrett ...
2007-07-16 17:53:17
95.   fansince77
You mean he had the curve ball and was SAVING it? Oh I see.
2007-07-16 17:54:16
96.   weeping for brunnhilde
77 I'm not so sure, his stuff actually seems decent.

Good break, decent fastball. Maybe the fastball doesn't have lots of movement on it, but it's serviceable.

I think the problem is that he just throws lots of cookies.

2007-07-16 17:55:39
97.   cult of basebaal
he's good enough stuff, if he had command ... but he's all over the place ... and it always seems like he's missing badly ... either way out of the zone ... or right down the middle
2007-07-16 17:55:53
98.   mehmattski
88 A rumor. Nothing on though. Could be because trades involving hitters with an OPS+ of 46 don't register as important.

Looking up Marshall's stats, and his age (24)... looks like a coup for Beane if it happens. Not every day that you can trade for a tall young lefty, either. And who's gonna catch for Oakland? Piazza?

2007-07-16 17:56:07
99.   OldYanksFan
73 Now, you have to pay Piazza. 2 Years ago he was a steal, 2 years younger and we had no BUC. Why they passed on him (for Flaherty) I don't know.
2007-07-16 17:56:25
100.   fansince77
OK - hate to beat a dead horse. Did you see the look on Igawa's face after the strikeout. HE HAD NO IDEA WHERE THAT PITCH WAS GOING! He was shocked that the batter swung and he wasn't looking back to the fence. Really- that was one lucky outing for Igawa- two swings of the bat and it could be nine BJ runs right now. He escapes with the lead - but we all know what we saw and how forunate the Yanks were to get out of there...time to send him down. No more starts.
Show/Hide Comments 101-150
2007-07-16 17:57:09
101.   Shaun P
115 pitches . . . no way he comes out next inning. Unless they're trying to fry his arm, which would be rather unclassy. Its bad enough when they do it unintentionally, by riding the bullpen guys too hard.
2007-07-16 17:57:20
102.   cult of basebaal
Who wants to take a guess at the Wheel of Guts Exacta tonite?

I'm gonna go ... edwar, bruney, EDSP, Mo

2007-07-16 17:58:38
103.   mehmattski
What a weird line: 5 innings, 7 hits, 7 strikeouts, 4 walks, 2 homers.

To the people who say he doesn't have an "out pitch": how to explain the 7 strikeouts in 5 innings.

Oh, and I guess Kay said Rivera was not available, not Proctor. EDSP is actually fairly well rested, for him.

2007-07-16 17:58:55
104.   OldYanksFan
87 Really. He doesn't even speak English that well.
2007-07-16 17:59:16
105.   cult of basebaal
79 ditto for damon ...
2007-07-16 17:59:26
106.   fansince77
102 I say Bruney, Edwar, Mo - and a photo finish!
2007-07-16 17:59:31
107.   Shaun P
99 In fairness, Piazza made it pretty clear (back then) he did not want to DH, that he wanted to catch, and that he did not want to play in NY (which meant the Yanks, since the Mets made it clear he wasn't coming back to them).

But now, he knows he's a DH, and he has no real say in where he goes . . . if his (shoulder?) is healthy, I'd take him DH'ing over Damon any day.

2007-07-16 18:00:32
108.   cult of basebaal
98 done deal ... nobodys out hustles the robothal ... bowen and minor leaguer not yet id'd

2007-07-16 18:02:26
109.   fansince77
103 Some of those strikeouts were strange- if you analyze at least 4 of them- he missed his target by a mile. Sometimes the element of suprise can work. Now look at how many balls almost left the yard and how many balls were hit hard. 4 walks and THREE homers- not good.
2007-07-16 18:03:06
110.   cult of basebaal
108 supposedly jeremy blevins is the minor leaguer
2007-07-16 18:04:35
111.   cult of basebaal
EDSP is in already??? there goes my exacta!
2007-07-16 18:04:49
112.   mehmattski
108 So, essentially they traded Kendall for Wil Nieves and Tyler Clippard...
2007-07-16 18:05:11
113.   weeping for brunnhilde
Well, what'd'ya know about that!

If it isn't our old buddy EDSP.


2007-07-16 18:06:06
114.   weeping for brunnhilde
Nice swing by Clayton.
2007-07-16 18:06:39
115.   Shaun P
110 Not quite Sean Marshall, huh?
2007-07-16 18:08:12
116.   OldYanksFan
It must be what... about the 13th inning?
2007-07-16 18:08:31
117.   Shaun P
112 I'd rather have Nieves than Kendall. At least Nieves doesn't cost $13M.

113 By Gameday at least, EDSP is just a little rusty. This is not a good thing.

2007-07-16 18:08:45
118.   weeping for brunnhilde
109 The point is that Igawa does indeed have what one would call "an out pitch" or "good stuff."

That's the trick, though, because as you point out, simply having good stuff isn't necessarily enough.

Exhibit A, the Pitcher who Shall Remain Forevermore Nameless

2007-07-16 18:09:15
119.   Shaun P
116 This game is versus Baltimore, right?
2007-07-16 18:09:18
120.   fansince77
have we turned more 2's this year than every before? - great turn- smooth as silk baby.
2007-07-16 18:09:29
121.   weeping for brunnhilde
I love this team!
2007-07-16 18:10:26
122.   weeping for brunnhilde
119 Ha ha ah aha!!

Good, so we'll pull it out, say, 13-11?

2007-07-16 18:10:27
123.   Shaun P
120 I don't know, but you could look it up.

121 Was that for the double play, or sarcasm directed at EDSP?

2007-07-16 18:10:40
124.   fansince77
Time to bring in Proctor...wait he's already in there, is there another Proctor in the bullpen...maybe a cousin we try.
2007-07-16 18:10:40
125.   mehmattski
112 And sure, you could point out that Bowen is three years younger than Nieves and hit pretty well for the Padres earlier this year. And you could point out that Blevins is a lefty tearing up AA at age 23, while Clippard is a righty doing ok at AAA at age 22. So it isn't a one-to-one comparison. But if that's what Cash had to give up to get Kendall (Nieves and Clippard), who here would do that?
2007-07-16 18:10:47
126.   Shaun P
122 And the time of game will be 5:23.
2007-07-16 18:11:18
127.   williamnyy23
It sucks to have such a bad bullpen. If I wasn't a fan of this team, I would come to the conclusion that there was no way a team with such a bad bullpen could make the playoffs. Of course, that begs the question of why not use Edwar and Britton and whatever young arms there are in the minors.
2007-07-16 18:11:22
128.   weeping for brunnhilde

How to get hitters out...?

2007-07-16 18:12:18
129.   weeping for brunnhilde
123 That was for the homerun.

I love when it gets interesting, you know?

2007-07-16 18:12:28
130.   mehmattski
I think Proctor mistakenly believes that the "baserunners vs outs" race I was tracking applied to him as well.
2007-07-16 18:12:29
131.   OldYanksFan
What happened to Iggy's curve? In his 2 effective starts he had a very curve curve and a good change. After those 2 pitches, his fastball looked quick.

His stuff is decent WHEN his curveball is on. His command sucks, and that ultimately, unless you throw 95, is more important.

2007-07-16 18:13:14
132.   weeping for brunnhilde
124 :)
2007-07-16 18:13:36
133.   Shaun P
125 Not me! I have more faith in Nieves hitting than I do Kendall. Kendall is D-O-N-E-done. Cooked. Toast. Finished. Over. The fork sticking out of his back is so big, Yogi can see it in New Jersey, and is thinking about picking it up.
2007-07-16 18:13:39
134.   weeping for brunnhilde
Good, good!

Ok, let's try to, oh, I don't know, score maybe six runs?

2007-07-16 18:14:37
135.   mehmattski
Dear Time Warner,

Stop trying to sell me Extra Innings! I already purchased it! I don't need to see commercials for it!


2007-07-16 18:14:55
136.   cult of basebaal
125 just because the cubs are batshit, doesn't mean we should be too
2007-07-16 18:15:50
137.   Shaun P
127 Go back and look at how the bullpen has performed, statistically the last, oh, 8 years. Seriously - and I'm just talking traditional stats (ERA, Ks, K:BB, home runs allowed). Its usually a great Mo, one other guy having a good-to-outstanding year, a so-so-guy, and a bunch of crap. Mo makes up for a lot of crap.
2007-07-16 18:16:34
138.   OldYanksFan
I'm watching the Boston game (I'm always a little jealous of Boston when they play KC) and they had what the announcer called a "1-2-3" inning. Can someone tell me what that is?

Boston up 4-0 in the 8th.

2007-07-16 18:16:36
139.   Shaun P
136 I like your answer better than mine 133. =)
2007-07-16 18:16:54
140.   weeping for brunnhilde
Alex isn't seeing the ball very well these days.
2007-07-16 18:18:12
141.   cult of basebaal
really lousy set of trades by the cubs ... it says something when you'd rather give up value to acquire the worst hitting regular in the majors this year rather than give gio soto even the hint of a chance ... guess they really want to believe the old canard about not winning with rookie catchers
2007-07-16 18:19:17
142.   Shaun P
138 IIRC, a "1-2-3" inning is when the pitcher gives up three in a row of anything - you know, home runs, walks, hits, wild pitches, balks. Or something like that.
2007-07-16 18:20:36
143.   mehmattski
140 That guy who caught his homer in the retired numbers begs to differ.
2007-07-16 18:21:02
144.   tommyl
140 What? Did he not see it well on his 2 run HR?
2007-07-16 18:21:21
145.   williamnyy23
131 On the radio, Sterling said the Yankees suggested Igawa scrap the curve and focus on fastball/change. They are grasping at straws with him apparently.
2007-07-16 18:21:36
146.   OldYanksFan
142 How about 3 - 390'+ flyballs? That's 1-2-3, yes?
2007-07-16 18:21:43
147.   Shaun P
141 Lou + unproven rookies who aren't future big time stars = tilt.

Lou also (over)values guys who "call a good game". Look at the dreck he used year after year in Seattle. And the A's pitching staff has all said how good Kendall is at calling a game . . .

2007-07-16 18:22:51
148.   Shaun P
146 I think so.

131 John Sterling, reliable source of information? I suppose its possible . . . but wasn't Igawa working with Nardi while in the minors? Or am I making that up?

2007-07-16 18:22:53
149.   weeping for brunnhilde
Man, that Jorgie.

I really don't see how he'll go into a major slump swinging like that.

He's just a different hitter than he was.

2007-07-16 18:23:59
150.   mehmattski
So, combining both trades the Cubs have gone from Michael Barrett to Jason Kendall, lost a young left-handed pitcher tearing up the Eastern League and gained a 19-year old outfielder.

Hendry's GM+ is like 60 or lower...

Mark Cuban needs to buy that team yesterday.

Show/Hide Comments 151-200
2007-07-16 18:24:00
151.   cult of basebaal
147 but that hasn't been the case this year ... he's been rather creative and he's gone with rookies rather than trot the same collection of stiffs (see izturis, c) out there because of their veterany goodness
2007-07-16 18:26:26
152.   weeping for brunnhilde
Man, Jorgie couldn't score on that?

Hit too hard, Jorgie too slow.

Damn it.

2007-07-16 18:26:34
153.   mehmattski
2007-07-16 18:26:41
154.   williamnyy23
DAMN IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
2007-07-16 18:27:07
155.   fansince77
anyone else having trouble with MLB.TV
2007-07-16 18:27:24
156.   fansince77
anyone else having trouble with MLB.TV
2007-07-16 18:28:34
157.   OldYanksFan
Ouch. My MLB.TV just shit the bed. Anyone else? Man, at an average of $100/season, MLB must be making a FORTUNE on this... and yet the service is still crappy.
2007-07-16 18:29:11
158.   mehmattski
Psh. Miggy coulda done that.
2007-07-16 18:29:11
159.   weeping for brunnhilde



2007-07-16 18:29:30
160.   weeping for brunnhilde
Way to go, Andy, nice hitting!
2007-07-16 18:29:31
161.   williamnyy23
154 Thank you Andy...I was starting to taste bile in my mouth.
2007-07-16 18:29:57
162.   yankz
I say we call him Febreze, the Anti-Stink...
2007-07-16 18:30:02
163.   cult of basebaal
andy phillips makes the baby jesus smile!
2007-07-16 18:30:35
164.   Mike T
Who is this Phillips kid? We should keep him around, maybe squeeze him in at first base.
2007-07-16 18:31:04
165.   randym77
Andy's been great since they made him the starting first baseman.
2007-07-16 18:31:37
166.   seamus
i also lost mlb tv. just got it back.
2007-07-16 18:31:43
167.   Shaun P
151 I should have been more precise, and said "young players", not rookies. For example, Theriot and Fontenot may be rookies, in the same sense that Andy Phillips (at 28) was a 'rookie' in 2005 - but they aren't young. And the young guys - Soto, Pie, Ronny Cedeno, and Matt Murton - have all been afterthoughts.

Admittedly this hasn't carried over to the pitching staff, but there Lou has no other choices (especially with the bullpen).

2007-07-16 18:32:13
168.   tommyl
157 Don't get me started on MLB.TV. While I live in NY, my gf is still in Philly. I bought it so that I could catch some games while at her place. Yesterday I tried to watch the game, it said I was blacked out, I called them to point out I was in Philly. They told me they could override it but we needed a land line (which we don't have, we just use our cells to save money). They then told me I could either look for a pay phone (which I'd have to do every time) or too bad.
2007-07-16 18:32:39
169.   mehmattski
Hey Josh: don't punch things in the dugout with your pitching hand.
2007-07-16 18:32:54
170.   Shaun P
162 That is an excellent name. And we may be rid of the Stink thanks to him, too, making it all the more fitting.

Way to go, Fabreze!

2007-07-16 18:33:46
171.   Shaun P
Two-out-rally (clap clap clap)!
2007-07-16 18:33:51
172.   OldYanksFan
For the unfortunates on MLB.TV, could we please have a lttle game update?
2007-07-16 18:34:53
173.   mehmattski
172 Phillips with a two-run Texas-Leaguer bloop single to center. Melky with a tapper just out of the reach of the pitcher for an infield single. Two on two out for Damon.
2007-07-16 18:36:34
174.   OldYanksFan
We are up by 2? Great! Thanks.
2007-07-16 18:36:43
175.   mehmattski
And Damon goes 3-0, then takes a strike, fouls one off, then swings way early at a curve for the strikeout.

In related news, Shelly Duncan has begun to get Barry Bonds treatment in AAA....

2007-07-16 18:37:25
176.   williamnyy23
I think it's time to make a decision on Damon. He either needs to see some DL time or be moved down to the #9 hole. His ABs are progressively getting worse and it makes absolutely no sense to keep in the leadoff spot.
2007-07-16 18:38:19
177.   weeping for brunnhilde
Come on, EDSP!
2007-07-16 18:38:59
178.   cult of basebaal
damon's numbers in july?

.205 .368 .227

his continued presence in the lineup is stunningly obtuse

2007-07-16 18:40:44
179.   cult of basebaal
175 not that joe would ever deign to ph for damon in that spot ...
2007-07-16 18:41:03
180.   Shaun P
176 I don't think putting Damon in the #9 slot is an option. The Yanks need to put him on the DL, haste post haste. A 3-man bench is bad enough.

I for one am pretty tired that Damon's "I've never been on the DL" ego seems to have become more important than putting the best team on the field. I also am distressed that I haven't heard much of this in the media (which, admittedly, I ignore). I know the guy gives good copy and all but geez, he's hurt and he belongs on the DL.

2007-07-16 18:41:24
181.   williamnyy23
Proctor is throwing BP...even the outs are being laced. Games like this depress me because it exposes the shallowness of the bullpen and really dampens the optimism that I want to have.
2007-07-16 18:42:47
182.   weeping for brunnhilde
180 No kidding.

First it's Hideki's streak, now this.

Who's in charge here?

2007-07-16 18:43:06
183.   williamnyy23
Matsui is the cardiac kid in left field.
2007-07-16 18:43:23
184.   OldYanksFan
Freaking MLB.TV!!!!!!!!!
What's happening guys?
2007-07-16 18:43:24
185.   mehmattski
179 Forget pinch hit... Shelly Duncan needs to have his Kevin Maas/Shane Spencer moment and be the DH now.

Easy there, Kay... initial misplaying, recovering, and overrunning the ball does not make an outstanding play.

2007-07-16 18:43:38
186.   Shaun P
181 EDSP is rusty, but he's been off his regular schedule of, you know, 3 innings every day. Damn All Star Break (and Jeff Karstens for not taking that bribe).
2007-07-16 18:43:42
187.   fansince77
still can't get MLBTV - they suck!
2007-07-16 18:43:56
188.   Mattpat11
Alot of people have been called at times, the most overrated player in baseball. Jeter, A-Rod, Ortiz, the list goes on and on.

In my humble opinion, Lyle Overbay takes the cake. This is a man that when the Blue Jays signed him, the pundits and talking heads decided that the tide in the Eastern division had been turned. And I just don't see it

2007-07-16 18:44:32
189.   williamnyy23
EDSP doesn't seem to be throwing effectively today. If the Yanks escape this inning it will be out of sheer luck.
2007-07-16 18:44:35
190.   OldYanksFan
Wow... even the audio is down. Piece-of-shot-MLB.TV-dkdmq!23891#@)mmXhXgg!#
2007-07-16 18:44:53
191.   weeping for brunnhilde
184 Hideki ran down a long drive to the track. He overran it by a half step and had to bring the mitt back, but he made the catch.
2007-07-16 18:45:06
192.   Shaun P
184 Thomas flew out to left, Overbay singled to right, Hill just flew out to left, Zaun is up. Proctor has thrown him 2 straight balls, and is, in general (at least by Gameday), working very low, many times out of the zone.

Or way off to the side, like ball 3 to Zaun (on the 3rd pitch).

2007-07-16 18:45:38
193.   weeping for brunnhilde
Zaun walks, representing the tying run at first.

Matt Stairs comes in to hit for Clayton.

2007-07-16 18:45:42
194.   tommyl
Seriously, did Edwar kick Joe's dog? He hasn't pitched since the Angels series before the break.
2007-07-16 18:45:52
195.   seamus
184 187 I switched computers and mlb tv worked. Try restarting. That kind of worked for me before switching.
2007-07-16 18:46:26
196.   seamus
no to myers. please. why not viz?
2007-07-16 18:46:31
197.   williamnyy23
Wow...I can't believe Proctor is still in there.
2007-07-16 18:46:32
198.   weeping for brunnhilde
Fastball inside corner, 0-1.
2007-07-16 18:46:35
199.   Shaun P
184 Zaun walked on 4 straight pitches. Here is Matt Stairs to pinch hit for Clayton.

This is the time to take EDSP out, before it becomes a 7-6 game. If Edwar wasn't so damn rusty, I'd call for him.

2007-07-16 18:46:45
200.   weeping for brunnhilde
Fastball low, 1-1.
Show/Hide Comments 201-250
2007-07-16 18:47:07
201.   seamus
198 your like 15 seconds ahead of me. wow.
2007-07-16 18:47:20
202.   weeping for brunnhilde
Fastball low over the plate, fouled off to the left.
2007-07-16 18:47:31
203.   mehmattski
For those scoring at home, the Yankees have allowed 16 baserunners in 17 outs...
2007-07-16 18:47:48
204.   Shaun P
194 IIRC, you called this before the ASB, didn't you? That Edwar wasn't going to get a real chance. No surprise, really.

197 But its the 7th inning, and the formula must be obeyed!

2007-07-16 18:48:08
205.   mehmattski
203 Er, make that 16 in 21 outs. Still awful.
2007-07-16 18:48:09
206.   weeping for brunnhilde
Proctor blows the fastball by him, right down Broadway, around the knees.
2007-07-16 18:48:24
207.   williamnyy23
Myers is awful, so it's really no big deal, but it sure looks as if the Stair PH appearance took Joe my suprise. Either that or Torre warmed him up late so as to not have to use him without exhibiting a lack of confidence.
2007-07-16 18:49:51
208.   Yankees Brasil
Too bad Farnsworth is not avaiable!!!!
2007-07-16 18:50:06
209.   mehmattski
207 Yeah, I'm much more comfortable with EDSP there.
2007-07-16 18:51:02
210.   hodengott
How patriotic ! back for the 7th inning stretch.
2007-07-16 18:51:47
211.   tommyl
204 I did, its maddening, and I also predict he will enter at some point, and having not pitched since the stone age will be a bit rusty and sent down to AAA. Meanwhile, we get to watch Myers and Krazy Kyle continue with their veteran presence on the team.

Its the same thing with Andy Phillips. They are like, woah, where did this kid come from? He can field and play first base? Just think what this team could have been with Andy as the everyday 1B, no Stink at all, and Phelps on the bench as a DH/PH and emergency 1B/BUC.

Shelly Duncan is raking in AAA right now and he will never get a shot. It is for these reasons I have called for Joe's head. I get pissed about the BP management and tactical decisions, but those tend to be more minor, game to game things. Refusing to give the kids a shot does long term damage to this team, this season and beyond. Imagine if Mariano Rivera was never given a shot? Are Edwar's numbers this year in AA/AAA that far off his? (No I'm not suggesting Edwar is the next Mo, but how back then did we know Mo was Mo?)

2007-07-16 18:52:34
212.   weeping for brunnhilde
This guy reminds me of Brendan Donnelly.

I don't like the looks of him.

2007-07-16 18:52:53
213.   Shaun P
203 Imagine how frustrated the Blue Jays' fans are! Wasn't that crazy "14 base runners, 2 runs" loss last year for the Yanks vs Toronto?

The Wonder Hampster ($1, Christina Kahrl) strikes out.

Meanwhile, in the Yankee dugout . . .

'The formula works again!' Joe thinks to himself. "Get Farnsworth up in the bullpen!" he says aloud.

"But Joe, Kyle pitched the last two days. He can't pitch again tonight. Remember, you told him . . ."

"But the scoreboard says its going to be the 8th inning next, and according to the formula, that means the 8th inning guy pitches, and that's Farnsworth."

"But Joe . . ."

"Farnsworth. Up. 8th inning. Formula. Must . . . follow . . . formula . . ."

"OK Joe, OK . . . here's your green tea, Joe."

"Thanks, Gator."

2007-07-16 18:53:11
214.   OldYanksFan
195 A re-boot worked! Thank you and all the announcers. And we held the lead too? Cool1
2007-07-16 18:54:16
215.   weeping for brunnhilde
Wow, Derek actually looks pissed.
2007-07-16 18:54:48
216.   Shaun P
211 I agree completely. Torre seems to have forgotten every 'lesson' he 'learned' in 1996. Time for someone who's going to take a chance.
2007-07-16 18:55:35
217.   fansince77
Those fucking pitches to Jeter were LOW! If they aren't than there are NO LOW pitches. FUCKING UMPIRE!
2007-07-16 18:55:47
218.   weeping for brunnhilde
What's up with this guy's tatoos?
2007-07-16 18:56:38
219.   mehmattski
Pete Abraham reported that Torre said the Yankees coaches see Shelley Duncan as "just a DH type." To which I respond: SO?!? The current DH is hitting like Tony Womack in a slump.
2007-07-16 18:57:11
220.   weeping for brunnhilde
Abreu trying to pull the outside heat.
2007-07-16 18:58:47
221.   weeping for brunnhilde

Alex strikes out on three pitches.

I hate seeing that.

2007-07-16 18:59:14
222.   mehmattski
213 Surprisingly, teams getting on base more than 15 times and scoring fewer than 5 runs has occured 130 times this season. Or is that not surprising?
2007-07-16 18:59:14
223.   Shaun P
219 My follow up to that question would be:

"And that's different from Giambi how? Other than Giambi was given a chance years ago, and is hurt now."

2007-07-16 18:59:23
224.   yankz
219 Whoa, don't go that far.
2007-07-16 18:59:52
225.   fansince77
Despite the HR, Alex is not being Alex.
2007-07-16 19:02:07
226.   Shaun P
224 You're right, yankz. He should go farther. The current DH is hitting like Wil Nieves on a hot streak.
2007-07-16 19:02:40
227.   Hocakes
225. If this is Alex playing injured then, ok. See: J. Damon.
2007-07-16 19:03:55
228.   mehmattski
223 It's not different from Giambi now, of course. But Jason got called up in his age 24 season, (two years younger than Shelley), and played 3B.
2007-07-16 19:05:03
229.   yankz
Hell yeah Viz.
2007-07-16 19:05:04
230.   mehmattski
I don't understand. The Blue Jays only had three guys bat. I thought the minimum per inning was five?
2007-07-16 19:05:04
231.   tommyl
219 And doesn't the team have a glaring need at DH right now? Oh I forgot, Damon and his veteranness have to be kept in the lineup. I'm all for letting players with track records try to play out of slumps (Jeter's awful start a few years ago is a good example), but Damon's has been more than half a season long at this point and he's in a tailspin. DL him, bring up Duncan, DH him every single day while Damon is on the DL and see what happens. What is to lose besides Damon's base stealing ability, which is irrelevant because he never gets on base.
2007-07-16 19:06:02
232.   tommyl
226 He hit two balls in a row out of the infield?
2007-07-16 19:06:44
233.   Shaun P
230 Maybe the Jays are tired from being on base so much, and having to stand at the plate for so many pitches?

They must want to go home and rest.

2007-07-16 19:07:31
234.   yankz
232 Man, you guys have high demands. I'd settle for making contact two times in a row.
2007-07-16 19:07:32
235.   tommyl
One more thing, the most basic thing Joe doesn't seem to grasp (and this took me awhile) is the value of a player at a given position. While Damon when healthy is a plus CF, he's really a subpar DH. Joe thinks more in terms of lineup slots, which is just plain wrong.
2007-07-16 19:08:57
236.   yankz
Won't this be 3 days in a row for Mo?
2007-07-16 19:09:55
237.   mehmattski
Wow... my baserunners/runs search on reveals that earlier this year the Royals had 17 baserunners, including 10 walks, and lost 1-0 to the Twins.
2007-07-16 19:13:17
238.   tommyl
236 Formula.....I do not follow this taking into account the number of days someone has pitched or nonsense like that.
2007-07-16 19:13:36
239.   mehmattski
Pending Pinstripes reports that Jesus Montero, 17-year old catcher for the rookie league Yanks homered in his first professional at bat today.
2007-07-16 19:17:44
240.   tommyl
239 Yeah, but also Betances left with elbow stiffness from the SI game. That is not good.
2007-07-16 19:20:15
241.   weeping for brunnhilde
I told you my feelings about Glaus.
2007-07-16 19:20:23
242.   yankz
Alllll righty then.
2007-07-16 19:20:36
243.   mehmattski
240 At least the Yankees have over-stocked their system with pitching prospects so that the inevitable elbow/shoulder injuries don't make much of a dent. TINSTAAPP....

Montero, meanwhile, could quickly become the third best position prospect the Yankees have after Tabata and Jackson. So positive news from him makes a bigger splash in the Yankees' prospect pool than negative news from Betances. That's my loopy logic anyway.

2007-07-16 19:20:42
244.   nyyfan22
hey tommyl - in reference to 168.. you know that you can mitigate that, right?
2007-07-16 19:22:12
245.   randym77
239 His first at-bat was today? Has he been injured? The rookie leagues have been playing for awhile now, haven't they?
2007-07-16 19:22:38
246.   Shaun P
235 After all, that's how things worked back in the NL in the 60s, when Joe played.

An unexplored part of the book Moneyball, to me at least, is how little learning occurs for most managers. What other job can you do where you receive no further training? I can't think of one.

241 Damn shame he's not back in the NL.

2007-07-16 19:22:41
247.   weeping for brunnhilde
Wow, sick pitch by Mo!

Nice job, Mo!

2007-07-16 19:24:38
248.   weeping for brunnhilde
Oh my God!


What artistry!

What magic.

My God.

2007-07-16 19:24:40
249.   tommyl
And Mariano Rivera shows how important command and the loss of it can be, no matter what your stuff.
2007-07-16 19:25:02
250.   weeping for brunnhilde
Mariano Rivera.
Show/Hide Comments 251-300
2007-07-16 19:25:11
251.   williamnyy23
I just have one word to sum up this game...


2007-07-16 19:25:32
252.   Shaun P
240 243 The nice thing is that Betances is just 18 still. A lost year (to TJ surgery) sucks, but he'd be back before he was 20, so no big deal, right?

Damn, but Mo is the bomb. What a pleasure to watch him.

OK, the Yanks survived the Igawa game. Who's next?

2007-07-16 19:25:36
253.   weeping for brunnhilde
249 Indeed.
2007-07-16 19:25:52
254.   mehmattski
243 The guys at Pending Pinstripes have been wondering about Montero's whereabouts for a long while, as the Yankees don't release much info about rookie league players. There were rumors he was out for the year with an injury, but he played his first game today. The homer was off Charlie Furbush, an experienced college pitcher who had a strikeout per inning at LSU this spring.
2007-07-16 19:26:36
255.   Shaun P
252 And to clarify, I have no idea if the kid needs TJ or not, just presenting a worst-case scenario.

251 Very well said!

2007-07-16 19:27:00
256.   tommyl
244 No, can you email me at and tell me?
2007-07-16 19:27:14
257.   williamnyy23
Mo is really amazing...a lead off triple doesn't score and it doesn't suprise me at all.
2007-07-16 19:27:15
258.   williamnyy23
Mo is really amazing...a lead off triple doesn't score and it doesn't suprise me at all.
2007-07-16 19:27:18
259.   weeping for brunnhilde
I like that Andy Phillips.

He seems a decent fellow with a good head on his shoulders.

2007-07-16 19:28:39
260.   tommyl
260 Its hard to dislike a guy who puts his career on hold to tend to his ailing wife and mother. Then doesn't complain when he's sent back to AAA, comes back up and rakes.
2007-07-16 19:35:38
261.   OldYanksFan
Jesus... Cleveland scores 5 in the bottom of the 8th. They trail by 1, 11-10, in the bottom of the 9th.
2007-07-16 19:43:20
262.   OldYanksFan
Cleveland leaves the tying run on 2nd.
Now 7 games out of the WC.
2007-07-16 19:53:50
263.   nyyfan22
256 Done.

Another got-damn nail-biter tonight. Good thing is, got the win on the 5th man's day. Let's go Phil Hughes (clap, clap, clap clap clap)

2007-07-16 19:54:11
264.   williamnyy23
If the Yankees can roll through this week, they will start next week with 4 games against KC. Meanwhile, the Red Sox and Indians will slug it out in a 4 game series. In other words, they'd be guaranteed to gain on someone. This is exactly the opportunity the Yankees have, they need to seize it. If they can go at least 8-3 over the next 11, then they will be back in either the divison or wild card race, if not both. If they flounder, well, then they don't belong in a race anyway.
2007-07-16 20:57:04
265.   fansince77
Did you see the look on Frank Thomas' face after that strikeout? By the way that ball did something unique for Mo- it seemed like a hard and in SINKER? almost like a screw/sinker...that was just plain nasty!
2007-07-16 21:10:11
266.   tommyl
Ahem, Shelly Duncan was 3-4 with his 24th HR of the season tonight. That HR tied him for the club record already. Seriously, what a lousy DH he'd make. I'm glad we have Damon and his 0-4, and his overall .241/.338/.333 in there right now. Is it really not worth it to DL Damon and take a 2 week flyer on Duncan? Wouldn't Shelly or Damon make a good bat off the bench late in a game?
2007-07-16 21:11:17
267.   tommyl
BTW, Damon also has one, count it, one extra base hit in all of July so far.
2007-07-16 21:12:42
268.   tommyl
265 Two seamer, it tends to run in to RH batters. That one did have some nice downward movement, but its not a new pitch for Mo. Thomas is usually pretty bad on inside pitches, and Mo set him up nicely with those two balls away just before.
2007-07-16 21:22:31
269.   Mattpat11
On the Igawa front, you know you suck when you give up three earned runs in five innings and your ERA goes down.
2007-07-16 21:23:21
270.   tommyl
216 You know, I've been thinking a lot about this and I don't think the phenomenon is unique to baseball. I've seen a few soccer coaches, most notably last year's Brazil coach stick to veterans long after he should. Its fair to say that playing Ronaldo (and to a lesser extent Roberto Carlos) over players like Robinho cost Brazil a shot at the World Cup.

I think coaches just become attached to certain players if they've been their awhile. Its not a bad thing from a personal standpoint, but it is bad for business. Joe has become attached to certain players like Jeter, Mo and Bernie, but I also think he's become attached to a type, namely the gritty veteran. The thing that galls me the most is that Joe always claims he doesn't know who this kid is who was just handed to him from AAA each and every time. Seriously? I'm not asking him to be appraised of the entire farm system, but maybe he should acquaint himself with a few players from AAA not named Phil?

There's not too much you can do about it at this point. Barring another huge tailspin, this team is Joe's and I still think he's wonderful at handling the media/personalities (Lofton and Sheff notwithstanding). However, I do think he lacks the skill set for the team he presently has, which is one in transition. Every single other team goes into every season with a few callups and they see how they pan out. Taking Hughes out of the equation, when was the last time the Yankees called up a player to stay that wasn't forced upon them by complete injury depletion or Tony Womack (Cano, Cabrera, Wang)?

2007-07-16 21:33:18
271.   yankz
270 Who else besides Duncan provided a more viable option than someone on the big league squad? Besides Cano and Co.?
2007-07-16 21:35:33
272.   tommyl
271 Britton, Henn and Ramirez are better than Myers, Villone and Farnsworth, or at the very least have the chance to be and are a lot cheaper.
2007-07-16 21:39:17
273.   tommyl
271 Oh, and letting Pena go instead of giving him a shot. Yeah, that's also worked out well.
2007-07-16 21:46:03
274.   Yankee Fan in Chicago
270 Nail on head with the soccer comparison. Brazil essentially trotted out muchof the team in 06 that that had lost the 98 final to France.

Also, another valid comparison is Bruce Arena and the US in 06. Eddie Pope at center-back? The guy needed a friggin wheel chair.

Meanwhile when we won the Gold Cup a few weeks back Arena got all misty-eyed in a newspaper interview about how those were his boys, how he'd laid the foundation for the win, etc.

Bullcrap. The best US player was Feilhaber, whom Arena didn't even look twice at. Why? Because Feilhaber was playing for the 2nd team at Hamburg in the Bundesliga, and Bruce would rather trot out the same old tired MLS "stars".

Sorry to interrupt this Yankee discussion to air my footy grievances against Arena, though it does show that Torre has his peers, and that in some instances they're worse than he.

2007-07-16 21:50:58
275.   tommyl
274 Its fine by me, I had much of the same feelings with Arena, though my true wrath was saved for the Argentinean coach who lost with Leo Messi on the bench, never touching the ball. That is criminal, it'd be akin to batting one of the greatest hitters of all time 8th or something....I kid, I kid. Hmmm...what did that coach do after their loss? ;)

Of course, my real problem with US Soccer is that they never, ever play friendlies against European teams in Europe. Yes, its all well and good they can beat Honduras in Texas, but they need to get used to playing a team like Germany in Europe. Until they do that, I don't see them doing too well.

2007-07-16 21:56:04
276.   tommyl
274 Well the other problem with Brazil was that they played Ronaldinho out of position. That's pretty dumb, of course I suck at Football Manager so what do I know.
2007-07-17 05:47:08
277.   Jim Dean
From Tyler:

"Farnsie has the most experience doing that for the eighth and the ninth; he was a closer, too," Torre said. "I'd have to see something really bad from him where he was very inconsistent, and I haven't seen that."

Yup. This is your manager.

2007-07-17 06:11:06
278.   tommyl
277 Eh, I'm hoping that's just trying to build up his ego or his selling price, sort of like when he cited T-Long's presence in the clubhouse or whatnot. I rarely take what Torre says about a struggling player to the media at face value.
2007-07-17 06:28:12
279.   Shaun P
277 278 Now I know for sure - the Yanks are trying to deal Farnsworth.

What's worse, (A) that we know Torre is lying through his teeth, or (B) that there are decision makers employed by major league baseball teams who read (or hear) what Torre says, and trust it without looking at how Kyle has actually performed? I pick (B).

C'mon, Krivsky and Gillick, you know you want a shiny former Closer . . .

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