Baseball Toaster Bronx Banter
Snake Eyes
2006-06-27 20:08
by Cliff Corcoran
Note: The Bronx Banter blog has moved to

Jaret Wright and Horacio Ramirez are pretty evenly matched, but go figure that their pairing would result in a pitchers duel. That's exactly what happened last night, with the Braves clinging to a 1-0 lead after six frames, that run scoring in the second when Jeff Francoeur singled home Andrew Jones' lead-off double.

Jaret Wright completed the sixth inning for the first time since June 2, equalling his longest outing of the year, allowing just three other hits, all singles, and two walks while striking out four. Ramirez, meanwhile, had held the Yankees scoreless on four hits and a walk through the end of the sixth despite striking out just one.

With Wright at 90 pitches and three lefties due up in the seventh, Joe Torre brought in Ron Villone, who promptly doubled the Braves lead by surrendering a lead-off home run to Adam LaRoche on his first pitch of the night. Villone then got the next three men to ground out and the Yankees finally broke through against Ramirez, getting LaRoche's run back in bottom of the seventh on singles by Jorge Posada and Melky Cabrera.

Cabrera's RBI single was proceeded by groundouts by Bernie Williams and Andy Phillips, which pushed Posada to second and third respectively. The contrast between Phillips' and Cabrera's at-bats was a telling look at the frustrating nature of baseball that so tortured Paul O'Neill during his 17 year career. The first pitch to Phillips was a fastball inside that Andy laced past Chipper Jones at third, but just foul. Phillips then swung through a slider inside to fall behind 0-2. He then fouled a fastball straight back to stay alive. Ramirez then tried to get him to chase a breaking pitch low and away, but Andy laid of that one and two more up and away out of the zone to run the count full. Ramirez finally came back inside where Phillips could really rip one and after fouling off Ramirez's seventh pitch, Phillips laced another shot between Jones and the third base bag only to have Jones backhand the ball and fire to first for the out. Phillips' at-bat was the hardest any Yankee had made Ramirez work all night, but despite getting the pitch he wanted and hitting it well, Phillips had nothing to show for it. Cabrera then came up and hacked at the first pitch he saw, a slider that looked headed for his front shin, producing a weak looping grounder that headed straight for Jones, only the ball took an odd last hop and Chipper booted it, conspiring with favorable official scoring to give Cabrera an RBI base hit. Such is baseball.

Villone came back out to start the eighth, but was again greeted by a hit, this time an Edgar Renteria single. After Chipper Jones lined out to left, Joe Torre brought in rookie T.J. Beam to face Andruw Jones. It was an impressive move on Torre's part, trusting a rookie to face one of the league's top hitters late in a one-run game (though I wonder if he would have done it up by one run rather than down by one run). The tall, lanky Beam rewarded Torre's faith by striking out Jones on a sequence of hard, mid-90s heaters for the second out. Unfortunately, Beam forgot about Renteria on first and while Beam worked to the next batter, Brian McCann, Renteria practically waltzed over to second. Behind McCann 2-1, Beam intentionally walked the lefty to face righty Jeff Francoeur. Beam got ahead of the free-swinging Francoeur 1-2 only to have Francoeur pick the 1-2 pitch practically out of the dirt and loop it into shallow center for another RBI single. Mike Myers came in to get the lefty LaRoche for the final out.

Again down two runs, the Yankees failed to do anything with a lead-off single by Derek Jeter in the bottom of the eighth when Jason Giambi was unable to beat out a squibber down the third base line, Alex Rodriguez struck out swinging on a slider down and in from Ramirez and Jorge Posada launched a pitch to deep left that settled into the glove of Ryan Langerhans for the third out.

Still, Joe Torre didn't back off, going to Kyle Farnsworth in the ninth. Unfortunately, Farnsworth's recent struggles continued. Pinch-hitter Marcus Giles lead off with a single and moved to second on a wild pitch. With one out, Wilson Betemit singled to left and third base coach Fredi Gonzalez sent Giles home. From deep in left field, Melky Cabrera fired a strike to Jorge Posada that had Giles beat easily, but Posada, likely anticipating Giles' arrival, flinched, booting the ball and allowing Giles to score. Betemit moved to second on the play. Farnsworth then struck out Renteria on a full count, but his second pitch to Chipper Jones skipped past Posada for a passed ball that moved Betemit to third. That prompted a mound visit from Ron Guidry. As Farnsworth and Posada waited for Gator to arrive, Farnsworth turned his back on Posada and walked off the back of the mound. When Guidry arrived, Farnsworth returned to the mound and Posada stormed off toward home plate. After Guidry returned to the dugout, Jones doubled Betemit home and Joe Torre replaced Farnsworth with Matt Smith. Smith intentionally walked Andruw Jones, unintentionally walked Brian McCann, and struck out Francoeur to end the inning.

Down 5-1 in the bottom of the ninth, Melky Cabrera hit his second career home run with two outs, but that was all the Yankees could muster against newly appointed closer Jorge Sosa to fall 5-2 after beating the Braves by the same score the night before.

For what it's worth, Cabrera's homer was his first from the left side of the plate and was a convincing short-porch shot on a pitch down and in. Cabrera finished the night having gone three for four, driving in both of the Yankees' runs and scoring one of them. Cabrera and Jorge Posada combined for five of the Yankees' nine hits. On Monday night, Jason Giambi drove in all five of the Yankees' runs, scoring two of them and he and Andy Phillips combined for five of the Yankees' nine hits. For those inclined to read something into that, those similarities are fun, but meaningless.

This afternoon, the Yankees get their third exciting pitching match-up in four days with a hot Chien-Ming Wang taking on John Smoltz in the series' rubber game. Weather permitting, of course.

Comments (66)
Show/Hide Comments 1-50
2006-06-27 22:49:16
1.   Yu-Hsing Chen
On the bright side, the Yanks always seem to hit big name pitchers better ?
2006-06-27 23:10:57
2.   brockdc
1 This question has GOT to be addressed. After all, teams with far less vaunted lineups rake #4 and #5 pitchers while the Yanks always seem to struggle. But why? Is it a function of poor scouting, overconfidence, or a combination of the two.
2006-06-27 23:31:50
3.   Yu-Hsing Chen
2 or maybe just the fact that the Yanks as a whole been struggling badly this year?

One of the main difference between now and when we were hot in May is simply that the RISP is horrible. it's not that we aren't hitting against these guys, it's that we simply not bring the guys on back or hitting our homeruns when guys are on . (yesterday was the exception

2006-06-28 00:02:48
4.   yankz
A ten game win streak would sound pretty good right about now. Seems like ages ago, doesn't it?
2006-06-28 03:04:19
5.   Alex Belth
The offense was bad last night but I watched the whole thing and I give credit to Ramirez. He pitched a good game.

I freakin took the day off of work today to go to the game. It's mad early in the a.m. and man, it looks like it's going to be warshed out.

Grumble, grumble, grumble.

2006-06-28 03:50:23
6.   Paul in Boston
Someone posted last night that they'd take a week off from baseball if the Yanks situation didn't improve soon. I've had those same feelings myself, both recently and in the past, but no better by now! We're hooked ...
2006-06-28 03:55:18
7.   randym77
I blame it on Jeter's birthday party last night. Melky apparently wasn't invited. ;-)

The forecast shows the rain clearing up in the afternoon. I think they'll get the game in. Though it might be delayed.

2006-06-28 05:08:40
8.   rbj
Beam looked good, except for the brain fart on Renteria. It was a good pitch to Francouer, who unfortunately was able to golf where they ain't. And Wright looked good.
Is it just me, or does Kay seem feisty lately. I wasn't online last night, but did anyone else pick up on Kay basically calling out Torre for removing Wright after 6, when he had only thrown 90 pitches?
2006-06-28 05:11:51
9.   randym77
All the YES crew was feisty last night. Frustrated or emboldened by the Yankees' struggles, maybe? They went on and on about A-Rod. They're usually pretty supportive and positive, but man, they went on a tear. Especially Justice.
2006-06-28 05:58:12
10.   Dimelo
Alex, any day out of work - rain or no rain - is still a better day than being at work.

So the title reads "Snake Eyes". Every time I think I read that title I think of my favorite G.I. Joe character. I'm feeling a little dense, what's that ('Snake Eyes') suppose to really mean in relation to last night's game?

2006-06-28 06:05:59
11.   unpopster
I thought last night's post-game comments by Justice were on the mark. Answering the "party line" excuse that Arod is a HOF-type player and will eventually step up and hit like he's expected to, Justice argued that if Arod should start hitting like an MVP in 2 weeks, where will the Yankees be by then? Justice argued that Arod has been MIA in June and he needs to start hitting NOW, not in 2 weeks when it just might be too late for this team.

As for the current state of affairs with the team, I will argue this until I turn blue: Cashman needs to make a move for a run-producing corner-OF now, not tomorrow or July 31st. Pitching will be available in the next month and, contrary to the opinions of some here at BB, is not the Yankee's pressing need -- offense is.

In the month of June (25 games), the Yankee pitching has given up more than 5 runs per game a total of 8 times. Over that same period, the Yankee offense has scored less than 5 runs a game a total of 11 times. Of those 8 games that they've given up over 5 runs, the Yanks are 1-7. Of the 11 games that they scored less than 5 runs, the Yanks are 3-8.

In the last 10 games, the Yankee offense has score less than 3 runs a total of 5 times and have score more than 5 runs a total of TWO times.

Pitching has NOT been the problem thus far, it has been the ability to consistantly score runs.

2006-06-28 06:06:11
12.   randym77
"Snake eyes" is slang for throwing 2 (when rolling a pair of dice). I guess the two single dots are supposed to look like a pair of eyes. So I assume "snake eyes" refers to the number of runs the Yanks scored last night.
2006-06-28 06:27:03
13.   Dimelo it makes sense. Thanks, randym!
2006-06-28 06:50:18
14.   Tarheel
11 I have been, and still am a huge fan/supporter of Arod. But, I am beginning to wonder if he will "get it going" this year. However, it is not just him, the whole offense is in a funk. I just wonder if missing the two big run producing outfielders is beginning to catch up. They definitely don't give Arod anything to hit. He has no protection now. I almost think it would be better to bat him in front of Giambi. If not, he needs to be more patient and take more walks. He swings at alot of bad pitches.
2006-06-28 06:56:23
15.   ChuckM
Kay has been yapping about Wright the last couple of starts now, first he was openly questioning whether it is worth leaving a guy in the rotation if he can only give you 5 innings, especially with his contract. Last nite was just an extension of that, since his pitch count was still kinda low, at leats for a normal hurler...
2006-06-28 07:07:04
16.   Dimelo
14 Good point.
2006-06-28 07:12:06
17.   unpopster
14 look, I'm no hater! There is nothing that I'd like more than to be proven wrong and see Arod take off and carry the offense for an extended period of time...but I too am beginning to wonder whether we are witnessing his worst offensive season of his career and whether he will be boo'd out of Gotham.

Last night Justice (or was it Leiter?) pointed out that Arod won the MVP with 48 HR's. That caught my attention because I forgot how many he actually hit. It is now the end of June and Arod has a total of 15 HR's and is in a homer drought. At this pace, he will be lucky if he hits more than 30 HRs on the season.

Look, the team NEEDS his offense right now and he is failing them. If there was EVER a time to step up and carry the O, it's when your #1 competitor in the division is reeling off 10 wins in a row. NOW, not 2 weeks from now, is when Arod MUST step up and deliver. I fear that he won't and the team will suffer because of it.

As I've said repeatedly on this board, with the loss of Matsui and Shef, an extended slump by either Giambi, Arod or Posada will doom this team. Well, Arod is officially in a very extended slump and as the numbers point out, our offense is indeed anemic. if it wasn't for Giambi's heroics in Monday night's game, we might be looking at a Braves sweep in the Bronx today. If Giambi should hit a dry spell, god help this team.

Cashman, go out and make a move today...before it's too late!

2006-06-28 07:24:09
18.   Dimelo
Why am I still very calm about this team? I still don't think Cashman needs to make a move.

The Sawx aren't going to win every game and the Yanks ARE going to play better. I don't know, I guess after last year....things just look so much better this year.

2006-06-28 07:26:59
19.   randym77
I think they should try A-Rod in the two-hole. It worked in 2004. It'll remind him to take walks rather than swing at bad pitches. He'd have Jeter and Giambi behind him for protection. And Jeter hits better in the three-hole anyway.
2006-06-28 07:29:46
20.   randym77
18 I agree. I'm not in a panic. The Red Sox have been very lucky. We haven't. Bats will slump, no matter how many sluggers you have.

The thing is...we've "made a move" before. We've been going with the "buy an aging veteran" plan for five years. It hasn't worked. Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result. We have to do something different.

2006-06-28 07:52:18
21.   unpopster
18 "The thing is...we've 'made a move' before."

But a move is necessary. When there's a whole, fill it, pronto. Last year the team's pressing need was starting pitching so cashman went out and traded for Chacon and grabbed Small. Right now (and for the forseeable future) the need is offense. So, Cashman, go out and get help.

Acquiring aging veterans has worked in the past (see Justice in 2000) but I am not lobbying for a mega-deal (e.g. Soriano) because it'll cost Hughes. But any upgrade over Bubba/Melky/Reese/Thompson/etc. is a huge upgrade to the team.

I'm still in the "Get Reggie Sanders" camp. He looks like a pr!ck and he might be a K machine, but he hits for power and can drive in runs. Based on this season, he obviously likes hitting in Yankee Stadium and he would elongate the lineup by hitting behind Posada in the #6 or #7 hole. And, I'm pretty sure we can get him for a few mid-level AA players.

Plus, when Shef and/or Matsui return, Sanders would be a legit bat off the bench.

2006-06-28 08:00:06
22.   Dimelo
20 I think a lot of that stems from the reactionary society we live in. Publicly traded companies need to grow at 15% rate, which is crazy, if they don't then people get "re-deployed", projects get cut, etc, etc. It doesn't matter that profit margins are great, if you ain't showing growth then you simply ain't worth investing for. What does this have to do with the Yanks? We talk about wanting a plan for the future, but the minute things start going wrong then it's OK to sacrifice the plan in order to get immediate gratification.

Can someone please tell me what corner outfield would make everyone happy? Not only that, what would you give up for that corner outfield? You know everyone wants a pitcher by the name of Phillip Hughes. We have a need, everyone knows we have a need, they know it is in George's nature to give up whatever is in his farm to make his team better NOW. Simply put, we are damned if we do…damned if we don't.

2006-06-28 08:05:31
23.   Dimelo
21 //I'm still in the "Get Reggie Sanders" camp. //

You do realize that the Royals offered Sanders to the Yanks for Phillip Hughes?

2006-06-28 08:11:17
24.   Max
I'm also not panicking regarding the need to make a deal (though I know I probably fool people given my frustration on game nights), nor am I sweating the Red Sox's current streak.

However, I do think what's contributing to the anxiety is the reality that the Tigers are 28 games over .500 and the White Sox 24 games over, and neither team shows any signs of slowing down.

With that said, funny things always happen..last year the Indians were one game over .500 shortly after the All-Star Break, and got as high as 29 games over, before memorably losing six of their last seven to blow the wild card. We were 51-45 on July 23rd last year after losing our 3rd straight to the Angels (Kevin Brown's last game), and ended up clinching the division on October 1st being 29 games over at 95-66.

So there's a lot of baseball left to be played. I'd sure feel better if we had a little more firepower in our lineup though, that's for sure.

2006-06-28 08:12:58
25.   randym77
If we can find a Chacon and Small for the OF, I'd be all for it...but Cashman has been burning up the phone lines for two months, and hasn't come up with any. (I'm still hoping for Craig Wilson, though.)

I dunno...I think we need to get it done with pitching and defense. We aren't going to replace Matsui and Sheff's production. And even if we hasn't won us a World Series.

2006-06-28 08:28:49
26.   mehmattski
20 Pythagorean Winning Percentage is a good statistical way of determining how "lucky" a team has been. The Yanks have scored 419 runs (#2 in MN) and allowed 350 runs (7th best in ML) which equates to a Pythag Win Pct of .581, 8 percentage points above their record of 43-32. The Red Sox, meanwhile, have scored 412 and allowed 360, for .560 (real world: .622).

So in this instance, your intuition is backed up by statistics. The Red Sox should revert to their record suggested by the numbers of runs they score. Indeed, another way to look at Ortiz's "clutch" performances is that they wouldn't be needed if the Red Sox didn't, for example, blow 6 run leads in the 8th inning.

On a scarier note, the Tigers' Pythag Win Pct is .652, only slightly below their actual record.

2006-06-28 08:30:39
27.   dpmurphy
The Red Sox have been very lucky. We haven't. Bats will slump, no matter how many sluggers you have.

Again with the luck. Guys, do you really want to hang your head on that? If either guys who run this site wrote crap like that they wouldn't be on baseball toaster.

Almost half way into the season, and the difference has been luck. If you really believe that, you know nothing about baseball.

2006-06-28 08:31:52
28.   tommyl
May I remind people that last night Cano was also out. That drastically shortens an already short lineup, so I'm not surprised by the dropoff. Fortunately, I expect Cano back sooner rather than later which will also help things.

I agree the team could use a corner OF, but as others have said, I just don't see anyone useful available (though I would also be interested in a trade for Wilson, he seems good all around). Reggie Sanders for Hughes is a joke and until it gets closer to the trade deadline, that's what teams are going to demand. Maybe as we get closer to July 31st and the Royals (or others) want to salary dump the asking price will go way down, but at the moment, there isn't a deal to be made.

One area I think we're actually ok, might be the BP. If Beam and Villone continue to pitch well, then a BP of a Dotel, Beam, Villone, Myers, Mo, Smith, and Farnsworth/Proctor (I know that one of the kids is likely to go for Dotel, but I can dream) is actually pretty strong compared to other AL teams.

Starting pitching has been decent to good as of late as well, though its hard to say if it'll continue. If the Yankees can stay close for now, pick up a decent bat around the trade deadline, get Matsui back in August/September, I think they can be ok. The Sox are on a tear right now, they will drop off and we'll make up some games.

2006-06-28 08:33:46
29.   dpmurphy
"Indeed, another way to look at Ortiz's "clutch" performances is that they wouldn't be needed if the Red Sox didn't, for example, blow 6 run leads in the 8th inning."

Which, since ortiz didn't blow the 6 run lead, your stat has nothing to do if ortiz is clutch or not.

If ortiz was playing in new york he'd be huge, and you guys would be loving him. You need to take off your homer goggles for once.

2006-06-28 08:35:35
30.   tommyl
27 its not "luck", its about statistics. Over a small sample size its possible for a team to be way over or under their expected record (Pyth. %), but over a 162 game season, almost all teams are very close to it. People are merely pointing out that the Sox have won many close games as of late while the Yankees have lost a few, and those things tend to even out over a full season. So we can expect the Yankees to improve a bit on their record and the Sox to drop off a bit.

If I flip a coin and it comes up heads 20 times in a row, you'd still expect that if I flipped it 1000 times, it'd be about half and half. That's not "luck."

2006-06-28 08:36:36
31.   tommyl
29 I believe the comment was about the Sox as a whole. No one (at least not me) questions that Ortiz is a great player (and I'll admit, what seems like a classy guy who deserves respect).
2006-06-28 08:37:54
32.   randym77
26 Actually, it wasn't my intuition. I saw the Wall St. Journal article that crunched the numbers and concluded that the Red Sox have been the luckiest team baseball this year. :-)

They're peaking too soon, mark my words...

2006-06-28 08:42:41
33.   unpopster
23 yes, I know. But Sanders is owed $5mm this year and another $5mm in '07. After Sweeney, he is the Royal's highest salary.

The Royals may ask for Hughes, but if the Yanks take the approximate $6mm left on his salary plus give a few AA players, the "small-market/out of 1st place by 26.5 games Kansas City Royals" might just do it.

2006-06-28 08:43:17
34.   Bama Yankee
20 & 25 Your right on the money Randy. Making a move for the sake of making a move is what cost us Jose Contreras. I also agree with trying to get Craig Wilson since he can play several positions including catcher (could we release Stinnett?).
2006-06-28 08:43:23
35.   Cliff Corcoran
21 The Yankees had Small in spring training last year. They didn't grab him mid-season, he had been in AAA all along.

20 The aging veterans of which you speak include Shawn Chacon (27 in 2005) and Jeff Weaver (25 in 2002). In fact, so we can all be clear about this, here are the Yankees big deadline acquisitions thus far this decade:

2005: Shawn Chacon (27)
2004: Esteban Loaiza (32)
2003: Aaron Boone (30)
2002: Jeff Weaver (25)
2001: Sterling Hitchcock (30)
2000: David Justice (34)

Only the Justice and Chacon moves made a difference. The Loaiza trade was more about dumping Contreras than getting Loaiza. In 1999 all they did was pick up a 35-year-old Jim Leyritz and in 1998 they did nothing, because they didn't need anything.

Everyone says "every year the Yankees go out and get what they need," but it's simply not true. Randym has it right, they'll "make a move," but there's rarely a payoff in fact, most of those guys turn out to be liabilities (I left off the fact that after they got Justice in 2000 they also got Denny Neagle closer to the deadline). Even Justice ran out of gas quickly after 2000 and the jury's still out on whether or not Chacon will wind up making a positive contribution this year.

All of that said, with Cano out nursing his hammy, Soriano becomes even more attractive, does he not? Play him at second until Cano returns then put Sori in the outfield when Robbie returns. Of course the Nats know this and it'll be Hughes or no deal, so it won't happen, but funny how that worked out, aye?

Meanwhile, on the subject of David Justice, other than repeating his point nine zillion times last night (Justice has Joe Morgan/Tim McCarver disease in which he says the same thing twice, paraphrasing and shifting his emphasis the second time, fooling himself into thinking he's elaborated on his point rather than simply repeated it), he failed to recognize that the baseball season is a marathon, not a sprint. So the other teams are hot right now and the Yanks are cold, that doesn't mean the opposite won't be true in August. You can't scoreboard watch in June or even July. Cripes, Rodriguez is pressing enough already, like trying to singlehandedly keep up with both Sox and the Tigers won't put him further in a funk?

Speaking of which, I've put a link to my pre-2005 piece on Alex Rodriguez's career trends under Suggested Reading. It's a reality check for those clamoring for a repeat of last year. My conclusion is essentially that you'll never see another season like that out of Rodriguez, but that's okay.

2006-06-28 08:52:10
36.   Shaun P
Dear Yankee Fans,


Warm regards from the grave,

Douglas Adams

PS - Remember, the answer to Life, the Universe, and Everything is 42.

2006-06-28 08:52:45
37.   Cliff Corcoran
Further to 35, in 1997 the Yankees big pick-up was Chad Curtis (28). In 1996 it was Cecil Fielder (32). Both were great for the Yankees over the remainder of those seasons. The Fiedler move, in fact, should be listed right beside the Justice move, though it's interesting to note that, after helping to deliver a Championship to the Bronx, both men were disappointing in their first full seasons with the Yankees, played elsewhere the following year and were out of baseball after that.
2006-06-28 08:54:09
38.   mickey1956
The Yankees are "cold" right now, but I take that as a positive. The yankees cold streak is .500 baseball(5-5 over the last ten and 12-12 for June). If this is the cold streak then this team will be fine. As far as Cashman making a deal he is playing it right. Just like he did with Johnny Damon he is waiting out the ridiculous demands(not that he's told me 1st hand or anything). The Sox are on an amazing hot streak, but it will come to an end. Noone here is suggesting a rash move, but over the last 6 months I've come around to Cashman being a smooth operator. He'll get a deal done his way or he won't make a move. The best trades are usually the ones you don't make.
2006-06-28 08:56:05
39.   Chyll Will
Does anyone have a thought pertaining to the question asked earlier 2 because I was asking myself the same thing throughout most of the game. Does scouting need to be addressed as much as the play on the field, because it seems as though the players just go on up blindfolded when they see a picther they've never seen before. I'm quite bemused how teams like Boston and Toronto seemingly will jump all over a rookie or some "unknown" thrust into a spot start, but when he's in against the Yankees he's suddenly Sandy Koufax or something. Even the Rues talked about it, there has to be something to it; if not the scouting, then the serious lack of preparation or discipline by the players themselves?

And, how much of that had to do with Small's success last year, versus his failure this year?

2006-06-28 08:57:05
40.   Bama Yankee
14 & 19 A-Rod's been striking out at a career high clip (4AB/K vs almost 5AB/K for his career). Obviously he is trying to make up for the loss or Sheff & Matsui (or he is having trouble seeing the ball and is on the road to being washed up... let's hope for the former). Moving up to second in the order is a great idea to get him going. He'll see better pitches and might not feel the pressure to "carry the team". Lately it seems like we would have been better off with Andy in A-Rod's spot in the order anyway.
2006-06-28 08:57:49
41.   BobbyBaseBall
36 Shaun,

We finally know the question. And we didn't have to build another Earth to find out.

2006-06-28 08:58:29
42.   Cliff Corcoran
Still going, 1995 was David Cone. 1994 was no one because the strike was coming and before that the Yankees weren't The Yankees so it wasn't an issue.

So Cone '95, Fielder '96, Curtis '97 . . . Justic '00, that's where the reputation came from, but it's been five lean years since then

2006-06-28 09:00:33
43.   mickey1956
42 It's funny. In 95 Cone had that Mets residue, and I thought trading uber prospect Marty Janzen was a huge mistake. Cone had the best career Yankee value of any player acquired.
2006-06-28 09:00:56
44.   Cliff Corcoran
40 Not for nothing, but Andy Phillips is second on the team (behind Giambi) in slugging, a point ahead of Rodriguez after last night.
2006-06-28 09:02:29
45.   mickey1956
44 How bad is his plate discipline hurting him?
2006-06-28 09:03:36
46.   monkeypants
The Yankees have made some terrible mid-season acquisitions, mostly (I think)( because they get caught in a "we need a player for X position" mode, and thus overpay for that position. This is part of a deeper problem with how this team has been constructed the last couple of years. The Yanks consistently get aging and positionally inflexible players, or carry weak bats, because they slot into some prescribed position (back-up 1B MUST be a 1B, so get Olerud or Lee or Clark or conver Phillips, so he can never play another position, etc.).

This is how we end up with slag like Cairo (we need a "back-up IF--even though we are going carry two SS and Phillips, who has played 2B and 3B"), and the when Cairo goes down, we bring Nick Green (we need a back-up IF in case our ex-back-up IF Cairo goes down...).

Right now corner OF is the biggest need, but frankly ANY additional bat in lineup would be huge. There must be room on the roster for plyers not named Bubba, Green, Cairo, Stinnett, Reese, or even Melky/Thompson/(aging) Bernie.

I cannot believe that a league average replacement player cannot be found for either LF, RF, DH, or 2B, who 1] fits with the Yankees 'budget' and 2] does not cost Hughes in return.

Can we find a solution within the organization? What about trying Pena or Durazo? Then move Andy to 2B or even throw him in the OF. I mean, is he going to worse than Bernie? Or how about the 'captain" being asked to move to 2B for a couple of weeks, move A-Rod to SS, and put Andy at 3B. This is an extreme suggestion, of course, but does anyone in the FO or on the coaching staffthink outside the box in these extreme injury circustances?

2006-06-28 09:04:35
47.   Bama Yankee
42 Cliff, wasn't the '93 pickup Steve Nebraska?

Sorry, I know that you don't like Brendan Fraser but I couldn't resist....

2006-06-28 09:05:35
48.   mickey1956
46 A-rod has not had great range at 3b. I'm not sure that short is really an option anymore. And could you imagine the boos if he boots a few a short after replacing Jeter. Jeter is not moving off short until he retires.
2006-06-28 09:05:54
49.   Jeteupthemiddle
9 I don't know what you've been watching, but Jim Kaat is NEVER supportive of Arod. For 2 years now, in every AB that Arod fails in, you can always count on Kaat to say "well, Derek Jeter would not have been nervous up there." Like he knows what the hell Arod is thinking.

And as for announcing, did anyone want to kill Kay last night? Not for doing any Kay like things, but for encouraging Kaat to continue talking about pitch counts...AGAIN...for like the bajillionth time in 3 days?

Sometimes I wonder if Al Leiter is physically restrained on Kaat rants.

Ok, ok, I admit it, I despise Kaat as an announcer.

2006-06-28 09:07:33
50.   Simone
Well, I'm worried and even more annoyed. It is one thing to play .500 ball against good teams, but the Yankees are losing to bad teams that they should be wacking much like the Red Sox are doing.
Show/Hide Comments 51-100
2006-06-28 09:10:11
51.   monkeypants
48 I know, I know. But it is frustrating how this team is so trapped by inflexible personel. OK, move A-Rod to 2B and Andy at 3B. Or the most logical--suggested by Goldman--Andy at 2B. Look, it doesn't matter. There must be an option that does not mean 1] Cairo is a full-time player and 2] his stop on the bench is absorbed by Nick Green (and 2a] that Cairo should ever bat in the 2-spot, even if he is compelled into the line-up).
2006-06-28 09:10:27
52.   monkeypants
48 I know, I know. But it is frustrating how this team is so trapped by inflexible personel. OK, move A-Rod to 2B and Andy at 3B. Or the most logical--suggested by Goldman--Andy at 2B. Look, it doesn't matter. There must be an option that does not mean 1] Cairo is a full-time player and 2] his spot on the bench is absorbed by Nick Green (and 2a] that Cairo should ever bat in the 2-spot, even if he is compelled into the line-up).
2006-06-28 09:10:58
53.   mickey1956
One positive note. The Yankees miss both Glavine and Pedro next series, while Mussina and Johnson will both pitch.
2006-06-28 09:13:28
54.   mickey1956
52 You're right there should be better options. I thought Kevin Howard would be an option if something happened to an infielder. He hasn't hit in Trenton, but would be a good platoon partner with Cairo.
2006-06-28 09:14:25
55.   Cliff Corcoran
43 Yeah, it's not even close, either. Of course Cone was a free-agent-to-be, so the Yankees could have gotten him during the offseason anyway, but they only won the wild card by one game in 1995 and needed a 25-6 run to close the season do to it, so clearly Cone made the difference as there was no margin for error there.

Of course, Cone blew Game 5 in Seattle by walking in the tying run, but I blame Showalter for that. Buck practically pitched Cone's arm off that year and pushed him deep in that Game 5 despite the fact that he was clearly finished. In fact, I don't think it's unreasonable to blame Cone's high pitch counts down the stretch with the Yankees for the aneurysm that threatened his career and his life the following season.

Man, Cone's Yankee career really was thrilling no? The late '95 surge and Game 5 walk, the aneurysm in '96 and the near-no hitter in his first game back, then the must-win Game 3 in the World Series. A 20-win season in 1998 ten years after his first. The perfect game in '99 and the fact that he was never the same after that game, leading to his attrocious 2000 season, including that game in KC in which he lept off the mound to catch a pop up and separated his shoulder. Throw in the fact that he finished his career with the Red Sox and Mets and was the opposing pitcher in Mussina's near-perfect game in Fenway and held that game scoreless until the eighth inning. Just fascinating stuff all around.

2006-06-28 09:17:54
56.   mickey1956
55 I live in South Carolina. I watched game 3 in 1996 in a bar with my Yankee hat on amid a sea of the Tomahawk Chop. That comeback was a great night. Everyone hated me by midnight.
2006-06-28 09:19:00
57.   randym77
I'm afraid we'll trade for someone like Matt Lawton, try him in the OF even though he sucks on offense and defense, then give up and end up benching him in favor of a by-then rusty Bubba anyway.
2006-06-28 09:26:31
58.   Cliff Corcoran
57 Nah, they tried that already. Didn't work.
2006-06-28 09:28:40
59.   randym77
And the lineup...

Giambi (DH)

2006-06-28 09:32:15
60.   YankeeInMichigan
55 You left out Cone's cameo ROOGY appearance in Game 4 of the 2000 WS, replacing an astonished Denny Neagle to retire Piazza for the final out in the 5th. Cone was then dying to grab a bat in the top of 6th, but Joe sent in a pinch hitter and finished up with Nelson-Stanton-Mo.
2006-06-28 09:37:00
61.   Bama Yankee
56 Hey Mickey, I don't know about you but I really need a win today to keep these Braves fans I work with in check (those WS wins only go so far). Everyone gives me a hard time for being a Yankee fan down here in Alabama. I'm sure you get the same in SC (btw, are you a Tiger or Gamecock?).
2006-06-28 09:37:10
62.   Cliff Corcoran
60 You know, the image of Cone walking off the field after that appearance did run through my mind. You're right, I should have added that. Man, what a ride for Coney.
2006-06-28 09:38:05
63.   Cliff Corcoran
By the way, I just put up a new game thread post since this one's already pretty full.
2006-06-28 09:38:22
64.   JohnnyC
All the suggestions about being creative and moving people around to get a decent offensive line-up with what we have on hand...this would smack of desperation for someone with Torre's mindset where every member of the team is locked into their proper slot, whether in the line-up, the bullpen, or the field. Cairo plays first base because he is, by Torre's definition, a utility player. Farnsworth pitches the 8th because he is, by definition, a set-up guy. And rookies don't play under any circumstance because they are, by definition, inexperienced. 11 years of managing this team have accumulated so many unexamined beliefs that were Derek Jeter and Mariano Rivera rookies in 2006, they'd be playing in Columbus. Torre was much more flexible when he was completely new to the situation in 1996.
2006-06-28 09:39:54
65.   Bama Yankee
59 Randy, looks like Torre missed your memo on putting A-Rod in the two hole...
2006-06-28 09:45:16
66.   mickey1956
61 Gamecock Class of 1995. I assume you Roll Tide. I get sick of Braves fans. All the entitlement of Yankee fans, but no rings.

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