I thought this was amusing...

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseball/story/347244p-296391c.html

Must be tough. Reminds of when Jeter was in that slump last year, and said he couldn't get away from it: even his doorman mentioned it every time he saw him.

Foulke was on the radio here (WEEI). Man, what a classless, spoiled, whiny boor. Not enough bad things can happen to him.

Furthermore, I love the fact that "E-Renteria" has the yips in the field. Makes me feel good that golden-boy-GM Theo Epstein ISN'T AS GOOD AS EVERYONE THINKS HE IS !

When you win the media and fans put a good face on it and, thus, Theo is a genius. In New York, failure instigates the fire drill of pointing fingers every which way and everyone gets slimed (except maybe Torre since he is "conveniently" blameless(sic)in front office affairs). If the Yankees had signed Renteria, who'd be the genius now? Same thing with Beltran and his downer of a season.

It's hard to judge a GM on one or two seasons. Sometimes a good signing doesn't pan out. But a good GM eventually gets more things right than wrong. Look at the success Billy Beane has had. He has made a few mistakes, but at the same time he has done more right things than wrong. And he has done so for a several years now.

But the decision by the Red Sox ownership to rely more and more on sabremetrics (by hiring Bill James, for example) has me worried as a Yankee fan. Of course you need good scouts as well. But the only team in the AL that has a higher OBP than the Yanks are the Red Sox. Those guys really work the count! Even the #9 hitter has a decent OBP.

I just thank God that Billy Beane turned down that job. Imagine what he could do with money!

Marc, in the last thread, vis a vis the ejection, you wrote:

"weeping, while I agree in principle, it's that mean viscious intimidating bastard giant quality in RJ that makes him the great pitcher he is. If he gets too nice for a game he'll become nothing but an awkard clumsy thrower."

I agree so let me suggest that, the situation being what it was, the better move might have been to just drill whoever was at the bat at that moment.

That way, he'd save face without involving the ump. But more than saving face, the absolute irrationality of such a move might really enhance his air of intimidation. Sort of like Nuke's plugging the mascott.

What do you think? ;)

I wish people would stop equating the value of a player to his salary.

Beltran and Renteria are both in the top 10% of players at their position. Any team would want them. Were they a GOOD VALUE at $17 mil and $10 mil? I think not. But overpaying a player does not make his value to the team any less.

The Yankees have overpaid players for years. George did this to ensure they became Yankess... to eliminate other bidders. Signing players is NOT based on their 'real' value, but how badly they are wanted by how many teams. It is more like an auction then a purchase.

I think Carlos is overpaid. However, he is paid the same as Jetes and is likely to outperform Jetes over the next 4 years. I'm glad we locked Jetes in. The Yankee's were spending money at the time. He is overpaid but I don't care.

Would you like Carlos to be our CF'er? Would you like him in our lineup? I would.

The problem is not that Carlos is overpaid. It's more that WE can't afford to overpay players anymore.

Hey folks, anyone else feel like it's 1995 all over again? Man that was tense, and this feels just like it. As you might remember, the Yanks went 21-6 in September to eke out the Wild Card. Does anyone remember how many games were left in the season when they clinched it?

There are two reasons why some people think Theo is a genius:

1) The Yankees spend $200 million in such an inanely unproductive way;

2) He lucked out by signing Ortiz, who has greatly exceeded any reasonable expectations of his projected stats.

In fact, one reason why George may be giving more power to the Tampa faction is that Emslie recommended signing him when the Twins cut him, while Cashman opposed it because Giambi and Nick Johnson were slated to be the 1B/DH combination.

The problem with overpaying a player is that it less leaves flexibility to sign other players. For example, the Yankees didn't pursue Beltran because they already had a $200 million payroll, in part because they have overpayed so many players.

weeping, with regard to Randy some of the post-game articles made him sound a little more of a provocateur last night and not quite as innocent as first seemed. As to drilling someone I have to admit I'm a namby-pamby when it comes to that and I just find it one of the more stupid and self destructive parts of the game despite its tradition. Further if he kept going ballistic about the strike zone could you imagine him trying to pitch anything inside once both pitchers would assumedly be warned? I was curious about RJ after the game and thought this was a excellent write-up on him I saw which goes through a lot of interesting history from his temperment problems to his great difficulties with mechanics being of such height as to make goood pitching mechanics almost impossible. Others may have known some of this stuff but I didn't.

http://www.jockbio.com/Bios/RJohnson/RJohnson_bio.html

Anyone remember Pedro yelling at the ump last year following some questionable calls, arguing location, then taking his glove off and offering it to the ump saying, "I can't pitch like this, here here, you take it, maybe you can pitch."

And he didn't get tossed!

He was a Red Sox player so I was pissed, but thinking back, sure was funny.

Still am at a loss why we didn't sign him, years notwithstanding, Cash dropped the ball there.

Rich et al
I'm not saying it is a good idea to overpay players. In the long run, it is (obviously) a bad idea to do this often.

We are lucky hwoever, to have been able to exercise this questionable practice some, as it allowed up to keep Bernie, Jetes, Posada, and get a number of others. It is nice to be rich.

I just saying to judge ARod (and Beltran and others) on their performance and what they bring to a team... NOT what they get paid. Alex is who Alex is... his salary has nothing to do with it. Certainly, if we had been smarter through the years and gotten more 'bang for our buck' on our aquisitions, then maybe (as a rich team) we could have afforded to overpaid Carlos.... not because he is worth $17 mil... but because he is worth having on our team, and would have been a quality core player for years. Fuck what he did this year for the Mets. He is young and quality, and would have looked best in a Yankee uniform and batting 2nd.

We have indeed, up to the Leiter, Chicon, Small signings, spent our money poorly... but not the money we spent to get Jason and to keep our 'core' guys. Maybe it would have been nice to have overspent a little and kept Petite. For a mil here or there... Lieber. For less then a mil, Cairo. Hernandez was a bargin we let go. We pissed away a FORTUNE on a historically injury prone pitcher (Brown) and a great, but old and iffy pitcher (Unit, whose contract we have to carry for 2 more years), and then saved pennies on Hernandez, Cairo, Lieber and others.

Penny wise, Pound foolish.

Come on Sheff!

As much as we need him in the lineup, it looks like Sheff is still hurt. With today's lineup, Bubba in RF and Sierra DH'ing might not be too bad. We need Sheff at 100% for our last 3 in Boston and (hopefully) the PS.

I am glad I'm blacked out, to a degree, I don't have to watch Ruben's adventures in babysitting in right field.

All right! This is more like it...

Bernie with the RBI single.

Cano with the sacrifice bunt. I hate that shit.

A bunt? The way Cano's been hitting?

I think it's Torre's small ball bs.

Jeter grounds out, no advance. Thanks Joe.

Torre is a rally killer.

Damn. I think Jeter is playing to his glove side a lot better this year.

Rich, I may be wrong... but in order to have a rally, don't PLAYERS need to get hits? Torre won the batting crown once, and was the best hitter at his position. Don't blame him if the PLAYERS can't score with 2nd and 3rd, one out, and the top of the lineup up.

Cano didn't hit into a DP to kill the rally, did he?

Is Torre always at fault for the 27+ times a game that players don't execute?

talking about a rally killer the Yankees actually picked someone off. That's a rarity

singledd,

What does Torre's hitting prowess have to do with his absence of tactical ability as a manager?

He took the bat out of the hands of one of his hottest hitters.

I don't believe in giving away outs.

Lob Lob, why oh why Lob.

Too bad Toronto ownership is allowing Riccardi to add $30 million in payroll. Trading for Wells would have been a decent possibility.

Chacin looks great unfortunately. It's obvious now it wasn't just bad Yankee hitting that got him off the hook with only one run but it was Chacin getting tough pitches where he wanted. At least Chacin has 60 pitches while Chacon's in the low 40's and is sharp also

Ok Ok, lets give Chacon some support here!

Chacon has only 47 pitches through 4. If he stays sharp he may be able to go deep today.

Dammit, Jason. How many times has he done that already? He thinks he's a lot faster than he is.

I could see that coming and I'm listening on the radio...

I don't know, when I heard Sterling say he hit it over 1st and it 's going into the right field corner I assumed double all the way so wither the guy made a great play and throw or it wasn't hit where it sounded.

The RFer fielded the ball cleanly. Jason needs his hits to bounce around in the corner to stretch a single into a double.

Chacon threw in the low 90s in Colorado until he pulled a leg muscle. He must not be fully healed because he hasn't thrown that hard here.

"I don't believe in giving away outs."

Fair enough Rich.
1) 1st and 2nd and no outs is nice.
2) 2nd and 3rd and one out is nice.
Cano is hot, but still makes out 71% of the time. He also sometimes hits into DP's

I won't pretend to tell you which situation (1) or (2) is better, and you can disagree with Joe's decision... Cano didn't kill the rally but Jetes and ARod did.

I guess I just am tired of Joe being 'blamed' for every more he makes. I have questioned many of his moves, but every fan questions (ain't it easy) their managers moves.

You can disagree with Joe and your logic may indeed be better then his..... but we got 2 ground balls to infielders from Jetes and ARod, so 1st and 2nd and no out may not have worked any better.

This is a great site to share our opionions and knowledge with other fans. But the blaming and name-calling is getting old.

Joe Torre's managing was NOT primarily responsible for winning teams in 96-00, and I don't think he is primarily responsible for this years poor performance.

And to boot 'Everybody Loves Derek' is doing very poorly in the clutch this year.

But I still love the guy.

Phew.

Maybe it was the thin air. Your curveballs don't curve in Colorado, but your fastballs are faster.

Not only is Ruben babysitting out in right, he's giving the kids a bath and making them do their homework.

I don't want to beat this thing to death, but he isn't making outs 71% of the time on the road, and he has been hot as hell in September.

I don't like Torre's managing. He's a big boy who is highly paid. Posts filled with frustration on message boards come with his job description.

11 LOB, we got to to do better than that.

Lets go guys.

Rich,

I have to agree. But for a different reason. Runners at 2nd and 3rd is great but the Yankees haven't exactly lit up the scoreboard in that situation this year. Gotta let Cano swing away there. He is .470 is September for Christs sake.

Chacin is much stronger against lefties. Maybe that was what Torre was considering.

Jeter has not hit well in the clutch this year. His overall numbers are pretty good this season, but have been largely unheralded (as much as Jeter can be). And I think it's because he's not getting the clutch hits he usually does.

Sojo sucks. I saw that coming a mile away.

I really can't take Sojo. He has killed so many rallies. He has to be fired TODAY!

What is Joe using that stupid stat book of his for, if not in that situation. Heck of a time to finally start playing small ball, some 6 months late.

btw, Matsui isn't fast.

Send em SOJO, hey at least he earns his nickname.....

To not use name calling in these instances would be ridiculous.

Ouch! That wasn't even close. At least no one got hurt.

3rd base coaches are mostly mascots anyway.

grrrrrrrrrrrrr.

Good enough Rich. Peace.
Re: 44. Stormer Sports

With 2 out and Sierra coming up, I think you try and score Matsui.

Didn't George fire Mike Ferraro when he was 3rd base coach for doing something that stupid in the playoffs in the early 80s?

sigledd,

Agreed, but not with one out.

miserable decision by Sojo. On the other hand I think you got be nuts to be a 3rd base coach on the Yankees or Boston, especially Boston

Chacon so has to get through the 7th. Get em Shawn!

marc,

Despite being a windmill at times, although not in comparison to Sojo, Randolph parlayed the job into a manager league job without any major league managerial experience.

I think Chacon has to go out 8.

Jeter with a back to homeplate catch shows why he could be a great CFer.

Nice back handed pick up by Cano up the middle.

"Agreed, but not with one out."
Oops... my brain fart.
In Florida, D-Train rolls throught 8 with a 2 hit shutout. Then he, and mostly the pen and the defense, give up 10 runs in the 9th.

What ever our bullpen has, it must be catching.

The D has been great for about a week now. I'm dating it from Jorge holding the ball last Friday when 'Tek popped him at home.

great defense turning very good pitching into great pitching.

Bernie with the lead off single.

Way to go DJ.

DP, well there goes our chance to knock Chacin out. This is going to be a tough one to pull out now.

Arrghh. Another 1 run lead. And no Mo this time.

Uh oh, Chacon walks the lead off hitter. He is probably tiring.

Warm someone up Torre.

bad time for Chacon to lose control.

btw, My disagreement with what Torre did is nothing compared to my problem withe what Sojo did.

Rich,

Who? LOL.

marc,

A loss of control late in games often indicates fatigue.

Shit, the ball hit the ump.

DP

I think Chacon is definitely tiring.

Jeez, if it's not catwalks, it's umpires.

They look desperate to make it to Gordon but at this point they may not make it.
DP, that helps at least

Thats what Im talkin about.

This may be a little nuts, and someone brought it up yesterday, but we may slip into the PS via Chicago.

We are 4 1/2 behind the White Sox. The have 4 against Detroit, 5 against Minn and most importantly, 6 against the indians. 8 of 15 on the road, including the last 7 games, the last 3 against Cleveland.

We have the same home/road schedule with 8 against Baltimore, 4 against Toronto (after today) and 3 against the (other) Sox.

I think the way Chicago is playing, going 7 and 8 is reasonable. Maybe less if the Indians are still on the warpath. If we win today and go 11 and 4 for our last 15, we tie Chicago for the WC.

I think we will need to win 11 of the next 15 for a chance for the PS anyway. Hoping for the WHITE Sox to choke may be more realistic then beating the Red Sox or Indians.

Am I nuts?? Could this happen?

Did Joe say no Mo?

Yes, no Mo, and I agree with him on that.

Three outs. Good job.

Shawn!

I see why Torre has so much confidence in Chacon.

Rich,

It's tough. I still say if you need him 16 days in a row, so be it! In the alternative, I do not want to see a soul on that mound in the 9th who is not named Tom Gordon, if Mo must sit.

We usually get to this guy. some runs coming up now

Okay, how about some insurance runs, fellas? Chacin's gone, maybe they can figure out how to hit Chulk.

do we give chacon a batter in the 8th? gotta have gordon ready to face the go-ahead run, no?

Arod looks like Mark Bellhorn today.

And Bellhorn's not going to win the MVP.

OK Rich et al.
Got a ponder-ence.
I'm told that warming in the pen before an appearence is taxing in addition to actually pitching.

We always see Gordon in the 8th and Mo in the 9th. The both warm up, they both pitch.

Would it be easier (on their arms) if Gordon pitched the 8th AND 9th on one day, and Mo the 8th AND 9th the next. Certainly these guys can pitch 2 innings and they would each be more rested.

Any thoughts from the balcony?

How'd Sheff look running to 1st?

I thought Sheff had a gimpy leg... I'm "watching" on sportsline.com.. How did he leg out an infield single?

Wouldn't hurt to get something from the 1-5 hitters today!

It was a tough hit. I thought it was going to go through. And he ran faster than he has been, though not as well he usually does.

singledd: longer appearances tend to lead to more total innings....that's why starters pitch more than relievers, and ace relievers in the 1970s would throw 120 innings cause they weren't brought in for every save...I like your proposal but it's SO anti-conventional wisdom--

Sterling says Sheff busted it down the line but didn't look so great once he made it.

I'm not very confident now. They have 2 innings with no Mo

Of course they could always bring in Leiter in the 9th but then there might be an investigation of betting against your team

singledd,

I have a thought from the balcony. I think Mo should pitch the 8th and 9th far more often, and Gordon the 6th and 7th if necessary. When Mo rests, Gordon should pitch the 8th and 9th.

It's absolutely ridiculous that closers being asked to pitch more than 1 inning has become so rare. Eck, Goose, they lived through it ok. Just one more recent baseball developement that makes little if no sense, especially given the fact that the stats don't bear out the benefit of one inning saves, or to put it another way, the stats don't show that two inning saves are detrimental.

Ok, bash me now.

Maybe they'll pick up another run or three. The bottom of the order is hitting pretty well today. Bernie and Jorgie are the only ones with more than one hit.

marc
No Mo is still in the minors

WoW!!!!
Torre leaves Chicon in for the 8th.
Good move!

What a game not to be on Extra Innings! Sounds like some very sweet glove work by the Yanks today...

Steerling calling Cano's play the play of the game. Was it?

It was pretty darn good.

But I think Matsui just had the play of the game. :)

Dynamite play. Save a base hit. So did Matsui just now! Chacon's loving this.

Who said defense doesn't matter?

Now Sterling's going crazy about Matsui's catch. Man I wish I was watching this

The problem with changing the system now is that all these guys have come up pitching just an inning at a time. Maybe if the A's decided to take Huston Street and convert him to a six-out closer, it could be done, but I'm not sure older guys could adapt. Rivera probably wouldn't have trouble, but I'm not convinced that Gordon could adjust to making two or three six-out appearances a week.

Nail biting, teeth grinding. Starter's still in there. Gotta go to Mo for the save in this one.

Great outing by Chacon. Don't let us down Gordon. More runs would help.

F it. Let The Unit close it out. This'll be his between start tossing from a mound...

Chacon has 109 pitches.
Can we start if in the 9th (with Gordon in the wing)

They are not going to Mo. If they pull Chacon, Gordon's going in.

109 pitches... why not give him the ninth?

Rags,

Send Chacon out there.

He routinely threw 100+ in Colorado. He should be able to hit at least 130-140 at sea level, no problem.

what a tremendous bounce back for Chacon from that Boston game. Him and Small just keep looking like the real deal

BklynBomber: I'd LOVE to see the Unit close it out. Of course, it would probably take him forty minutes to get loose...

Bklyn,

You nuts! Unit, I'd rather give me the ball to save this one. Not with a 1 run lead, no no no RJ.

Agreed. I think you have to let Chacon start the 9th. But I might need Mo for an out or two.

Irish are melting down. Shine is off the apple, I smell another 6-6 season.

Batista is too much of an erudite intellectual thinker. Blast the shit of him.

Hank,
What's easier?
2 - 6 out appearences -or-
4 - 3 out appearences
??
Remember, you are saving the warm-ups.
Both Mo and Gordon have done 6 outs numerous times.

i love the idea of Unit right now--hope Torre's at least talked with him about that sort of thing....Gordon's had one day off, right?

I'm glad I don't have to make the decision. If Chacon can do it, that would be great, giving Gordon some needed rest.

OTOH, Chacon definitely seems to be tiring. He got out of the last couple of innings due to terrific defense. I don't know if we can count on that for another inning, with only a 1-run lead.

True, Hank... but that would be something to see, huh?. I'd let Chacon go under a very close eye...

I'd hope that Mo is back at the team hotel enjoying room service right now, just to avoid the temptation of putting him in.

I like Batista, I think the Yanks should have tried to grab him.

Jesus...
the Sox won last night on 2 hit batsmen.
Common boys... take one for the team!

big part of the Toronto order in the 9th. Please, some runs here

I think this inning is set up perfectly for Cano to do something big again.

Who is warming for the Yanks?

Cano Cando?

Gordon is coming in.

1-5 shit the bed today.

Gordon is warming, but I don't know if he's coming in.

Canto

Rich. No Chacon, I just don't get Torre sometimes. Is rest important or not, which one is it Joe?

shit, I don't like our odds in the bottom of the 9th with no Mo and good hiters coming up

Why bring in a fastball thrower to face a fastball lineup with Chacon not really overworked. Only one real tough situation in the game for Shawn.

Chacon was clearly tiring. With only a 1-run lead, I can understand pulling him.

Why is it that every game is a nailbiter these days?

I need outs!

I can't watch... bad heart...

See! Fuck you Joe. You are as lost as a Notre Dame grad on MLK boulevard!

Don't fuck up, Tom.

See! Fuck you Joe. You are as lost as a Notre Dame grad on MLK boulevard!

Gordon can get these guys--c'mon

Fuck

Flash is not pitching very well. :-(

Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

Nice simile, SS.

Jesus, George fire that Fucking moron at the end of the year, JESUS!

If Chacon felt OK, this was dumb.

De-fense! De-fense!

it was a good game for awhile. I think we're seeing why Mo is really the MVP though he'll never get it.

Joe, you do know what a lineup is that prefers fastballs and can't hit breaking balls, right? Chacon should never have been yanked! Maybe he'll get Embree up!

Rich, we cant make the playoffs with Joe managing. The players play the game, I know, but managers win the close ones, and Joe aint doing that.

Koske 5-7 with a homer and 2 doubles off Gordon

K

Where's the 12 to 6 Flash? There it is!

Whew! Now if we can get YankeeKilla, Jr...

DP!!!!!

DP

If Gordon guts this out, he should get the credit, and Joe must get NONE.

Lucked the fuck out!

Wow!!!!!!!!!!!!

Torre's a genius. ;-)

Stormer,

Torre proof? ;-)

Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeessssssssssssssss!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The Cardiac Geezers and a Few Kids do it again!!!! I can't take this on a daily basis...

The YAAAAAKEEEES WIN. Stop trashing Torre unless you also note everytime his moves work out

Oh my...........
winning shouldn't be this painful.

But whats a little pain for a win.
Theeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee Yankees win!

What a F'ing game! We're coming' and I wan't the East! Nothing less than Boston on the outside looking in.

HEEEEEEE HAAAAAAAW!

Two one run wins in a week! First time all year!

Nice to put the pressure on Boston to win for a change!

Cornrows going tonight in beantown, good luck Haren.

I think the defense gets the credit. Without great plays by Jeter, Cano, Matsui, etc., the Jays would have scored off Chacon.

That last DP could have been a game-winning hit, except for a great play A-Rod, Cano, and Tino.

As much as this may take a few years off of my life, you gotta admit, they're keeping it... um... entertaining.

See? No harm no foul.

o YEAH!

1 run. Hopefully they score 10 tomorrow.

Dude,

How do you know that leaving Chacon in wouldn't have been a 1-2-3 inning?

You don't. Why do the Torre defenders want to stifle debate?

As entertaining as watching an execution.
On on Gameday it's really bad!

Entertaining as it's been, I'm about ready for another 17-3 blowout. Give me time to grow some fingernails back...

A-Rod MVP
A-Rod golden glove
Cano- ROTY
Giambino-Comeback player of the year

I don't know which will happen but all are reasonable choices

marc,

All are no brainers.

However, they're are plenty of Ken Rosenthal's out there.

Rich,

I don't, you're right. But I do know Chacon handled them pretty well for 8.

Rich...
It hard to debate what MIGHT have happened.
In a way, I wanted to see Chacon in there... for one batter at least. But the guy was one pitch from giving up a HR. It was a tough call. I don't think there was a right or wrong to it.

We got lucky.
And lucky is better then right.

Two one run wins makes us a NL team ao it's only reasonable they transfer us to the NL West with a DH dispensation

Shades of '78... if memory serves correct, that club won 32 of out their last 40. If this one keeps the intensity going, we could come damn close to running the table.

A 2 game lead heading into Beantown on Sept 30th is not out of the question. Wild card, my ass.

Aside from us, the Sox have a pretty soft schedule. We can only hope we sweep Toronto tomorrow, and they take it out on the Sox.

What about the WHITE SOX?
I want to win the division, but I want to NOT miss the PS more.

Very sweet win. Who'd have guessed that Jorge Posada would get the only run of the game?

singledd,

My only point is that it's fair to criticize Torre despite the fact that it sometimes seems that the Torre defenders (or at least some of them) think he is immune to it.

It should be noted that I agreed with him that Mo shouldn't pitch today, and I also said that what Sojo did was far, far worse.

As I said, for the past three days.

Indians will overtake the White Sox on September 28, 2005. Boston will miss the playoffs as the White Sox take the Wild Card.

I'm not worrying about the Sox (Red or White) or the Indians, A's, or Angels. My focus is on the Yankees winning everday.

"We play today, we win today. That's it."

What's scary is I think we've won 6 in a row and we still trail Boston and are only tied with Cleveland at the moment if the standing I'm looking at are updated

marc.

Rich is right. If we keep winning, we make the playoffs, simple.

However, a Cleveland and Boston loss tonight wouldn't hurt my feelings.

I think I'd like to see Cleveland catch the White Sox (possible), Yanks catch the Red Sox (likely), and A's top the Angels (also likely). Then if Chicago can hang on for the wild card, the Red Sox will be sitting home, which would be nice. Then the Yanks would host the ChiSox in the opening round, which is probably preferable to Oakland.

"We play today, we win today. That's it."

Ah, Mariano Duncan. Wonder what he's doing now?

well it least even if Boston wins tonight there'll be the little compensation that Oakland is further back in the WC and we all know nobody can close with unbelievable streaks like Oakland

Torre: Louie got too aggressive, especially on the turf.

How rare is it for Torre to speak the truth like that?

Of course we have to win. 12 and 3? .800 ball? Even so, Cleveland, Boston (or the White Sox) have to do there share or losing.

When I was a kid in the late 60's, the Yanks had worked their way from the worst team in the AL to contenders. 8 games left. 1 game in front of the dreaded Boog/Robinsons Baltimore.

I thought we needed to win 6 of 8. We did. Baltimore won 8 of 8. 2nd place, one game out. It seemed soooooooooooo unfair. Sometimes, the other guys gotta lose one.

First words out of Torre's mouth is incredible defense. Also Chacon terrific. Torre says Sojo sholdn't have sent Matsui especially because their outfielders know how to play balls off the turf or something like that. The pitch to Catalinata was a mistake apparently and was supposed to be unhittable but got too much of the plate luckily.

The wild cards increases the odds that another team will "underperform."

"New York leads the AL with 13 shutouts."
Can you believe it?

Boson 1-0 bases juiced and 1 out.

Holy Shit.
We sweat it out for 9 gruesome innings, and both Boston and Cleveland are kicking ass in the 1st!

Come on Oakland, win a fucking game will you! "Just Win Baby!"

Wow, Cleveland game over in the first. Jesus.

Here's a nice read to relax with after a yet another tension filled 3 hours of 2005 Yankee baseball:

Bricks, old wooden seats and an inner tube capture America at the plate

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2005/09/17/DDGKGEO80S1.DTL

Kinda tough to catch a team (Cleveland) that never loses...

Luckily, we only have to catch Boston. It's 1-1 now in Fenway...

Manny just smacked a HR so 2-1 Boston in the 6th. I'm trying not to get too emotionally involved after that draining Yankee game.

Cleveland game has tightened up. Now 5-4 Cleveland in the 6th

Oakland is really hopeless in the late innings of every game, no matter whom they're playing. Too bad, I really thought they could at least get a split of this series.

The A's have been disappointing me against the Sox for years now. Remember that idiot stumbling around home plate after colliding with Varitek instead of touching the damn plate?

Boston wins Cleveland looks like a winner shortly.

Cleveland hung on. I'm starting to wonder if the White Sox will totally collapse, the Indians take the central, and we get the WC or maybe the East and the other Sox take the card. We shall see.

Shit, Cleveland just won striking out the 3rd out with runners on 2nd and 3rd. So nobody's blinking and we only gain on Oakland which is hardly our biggest problem. Boston and Cleveland show no signs of backing off and let's face it, the Yankes have been winning a lot of games that could have and perhaps should have gone the other way. I just can't remember a season like this. We could play great the rest of the way and still not get in the playoffs. If we just play good there's a high probability we won't get in the post-season. Well, hopefully Cleveland, Boston or both will hit a spotty streak and let us in. When we think of it though this is pretty much what was known and predicted, i.e. Cleveland now beating up on KC and they'll have a lot more games with them to feast and Boston taking advantage of their home team advantage and getting one run wins when needed. Frankly the only surprse is the Yankees winning 6 in a row. It ain't going to get easier.

As long as we stay within 2 games of the Red Sox going into the final series in Fenway, we have hope. If we sweep we win the division. If we can hang within 1 game, and win 2 of 3 we get the playoff in Yankee Stadium.

Personally, I think we'll outplay Cleveland over the last 15 games and get the wild card. We will then breath easier in Fenway come ealy October.

The Yanks will be in first place by next weekend!!!

After tomorrow, the Yanks come home for 7 straight games at Yankee Stadium. Over the same period, The Red Sox go on the road for 6 straight games in Baltimore and Tampa.

In their last 8 road series, the Red Sox are 2-4-2 (2 series won, 4 series lost, 2 series split).

The Yanks are We all know that the Rays are not pushovers and Baltimore has been giving the Sox problems for the last few years.

The Yanks are 47-27 at Yankee Stadium.

You do the math!

What really scares me is Boston having their last 7 games at home.

unpopster, I hope you're right, but the Sox have handled Tampa pretty well all season...the last series they lost to them (home or road) was back in April. I'm hoping Baltimore wakes up and gives the Sox some trouble, but the Sox have handled them fairly well recently as well.

The reality is that this last week was their toughest stretch: 3 on the road against a team (Toronto) that's given them fits all year, four at home against a team (Oakland) fighting for the playoffs with very strong pitching -- and the Sox are probably going to end up winning 5 of 7.

If we can sweep Toronto, we'll have gained ground by virtue of running the table. However, it may be too much to expect much help from others in gaining further ground, especially since the Sox pitching has improved the last few weeks, and the Tribe schedule is so damned favorable.

All we can do is keep winning games, home or road, no matter who the opponent is, and let the chips fall where they may.

"We could play great the rest of the way and not get in the playoffs"

marc, there is a chance of this happening, especially since Boston and Cleveland have maintained as high or close to as high a level of play as the Yankees have.

However, the ongoing collapse of the White Sox has thrown an interesting wrinkle into the equation. While they still maintain a four game advantage in the loss column over us, they have to play six more games against Cleveland. If the current trend lines continue to play out, the White Sox' record will plummet further to around where the Yankees are. If the White Sox somehow pull themselves together, they may be able to apply enough of a hurting on the Indians to help us out.

But I think most people agree that merely winning a few more series and losing 1 out every 3 the rest of the way isn't going to cut it for the Yankees. Thankfully, the team really looks focused in a way they haven't shown all season for more than a few games.

So unlike you, I'm not surprised they've won 6 in a row, even with the patchwork pitching they've got -- I've been waiting for this kind of run all year.

I figured 95 wins would be good enough a while back, like many folks...but the way things are going, it might have to be 96 or 97 (!). That means losing only 3 games (max) the rest of the way.

We took three of four in our last series at Fenway. We'll just have to take three of three this time. ;-)

It is going to be spandex-tight. No room for error. It's worrying, considering how inconsistent the Yankees have been this year. I get the feeling they're playing like Avis this month: trying harder, because they're number 2. But how long can they keep it up? The missed opportunies - stranded runners, stupid outs - are also cause for unease.

OTOH, for the first time this year, they seem more or less in synch, firing on all cylinders. A complete team. They're winning games in a variety of ways: pitching, hitting, fielding. Everyone's contributing. Yesterday, it was the young guns, Cano and Crosby. Today, it was the old-timers, Posada and Bernie. Even our biggest weakness, the outfield, did okay today.

Max.

You're right. We cannot worry about other teams, although it would be great to see the Red Sox tumble a bit and the Tribe soaked by Chicago, but I wouldn't count on it.

I believe it is far too much to ask for Chicago to lose, say 10 of 15, and put us in that way.

The best case scenario is for the Yankees to be up 3 going into the series at Henway Pirk and come away with at worst, a one game playoff.

The more reasonable prediction is that the Sox series will determine whether we make the playoffs. A one game playoff being, almost fated.

How could this season end any other way?

I just hope it concludes with the presses working full time, ink flying, at the factory in New York producing new 2005:

Bucky "fucking" Dent
Aaron "fucking Boone"
Bernie "fucking" Williams

T-shits!!!!!!!

Stormer, funny you bring up Bernie with the likes of Boone and Dent.

A couple of days ago I was watching a game and I suddenly found myself pondering Bernie's career, what he's meant to this team, and the likeleyhood that his days as a Yankee are coming to an end...and then it suddenly occurred to me: This special player, this quiet man, this "gentleman of the game" is destined to be the one who breaks the Red Sox hearts in 2005. It would only be fitting that he ended his career on such a note.

I was almost sure of it. I still am.

Stormer...I think we're on to something!

unpopster,

Nothing would make me happier.

I hope that they can sign him, he deserves to be on the field in front of the home fans when he ends his carreer. I just hope I can hold it together, I know I couldn't the day Paulie walked off the field at Yankee Stadium for the last time.

You are right. Nothing could be more appropriate. Bernie being the "but for" reason the Yankees make the post season, and beyond.

I love Dimaggio, Munson, Mattingly, no doubt about it, but Bernie Williams is the embodiment of what it means to be a Yankee. The thought of the team not picking him up, no matter the cost, is, well, unthinkable.

Lets quiet the doubters Bernie.

After considering the possibilities and the difficult road ahead I have thought about one last ditch thing that can be done if all else fails. Consult Tanya Harding about Ortiz

I had the same occasion to ponder. I was watching a documentary on the recent Yankee run. There was not one major event, not one, where Bernie didn't appear, as happy as a child. He is so much more than his numbers, which are downright dominating in the post-season. He is simply a good man.

He carried off Wells,

He carreid off Cone,

He was one of the first to congratulate Doc,

He was there to help Rivera off the mound, following his collapse, giving this team all he had,

on and on and on . . . he was there.

What starting pitcing problem?

Hey guys, with the somewhat surprising news that Moose may be coming back fairly soon we almost have an embarrassment of riches of GOOD starting pitchers for the stretch run. We now have 6 solid starters when Moose comes back, not some rag-tag mediocre fill-ins Torre, Cashman and Stottlemyre have had to use all season. With Moose we have Moose, Randy, Wang, Wright, Chacon and small. That's a better situation than we've had virtually all year. We can actually afford it if one should unexpectedly go down, again something that hasn't been true all year. I also think that's a better situation than most of the teams we're fighting for a play-off spot. We also have Gordon and Rivera in peak form and Sturze is looking serviceable again. The rest of middle relief obviously sucks but we do have Leiter available to burn up innings along with the other miserable bunch in case it's a blow out one way or another. As I write this I'm getting psyched up that we are in a great positon to make it one way or another.

Anyway not sure anyone else is still around as I'm on west coast time equivalent.

One note to comfort the restless....

The Red Sox and Indians fans are out there worrying every bit as much as we are. Yes, they have teams in front right now, but we're tied with Cleveland in the loss column, and we're only a game back of the Red Sox in the loss with a 3 game series looming large at the end of the year.

Misery loves company, so don't sweat it too much. We're right in the mix and we have all the tools to be successful.

Living in NH, I get Boston media. Losing to Boston last year is bad enough, but I will now be bombarded with it for the rest of my life. If Boston never wins again, they will still play the '04 season on TV over and over, while playing that disgustingly stupid Red Sox theme song. Beating them from behind will be the only way get get rid of this Sox pox.

So for me, losing to Boston is more then a bummer. The season will come down to the last 3 in Fenway. If the Sox wrap it up there, once again my winter will be an everyday TV replay of it.

To go in 1 behind means we need to win 3 of 4. Take the series at Fenway and win the one game playoff in NY. This is difficult but not impossible. I don't think we can sweep in Fenway. The Sox are not intimidated by us, and are experienced at unlikely comebacks.

While this series will decide our fate, I'm afraid we may have already decided out fate by letting a shitty team (TB) with shitty pitching beat the hell out of us.

We must go into Fenway no worse then 1 game out.

Here's my prediction. I would love for Bernie to make the difference, but it will be up to ARod. He will have the most RBI situations, and will be under tremendous pressure... as he will know his ABs would make the difference.

He has had an MVP year, but he is not the greatest under pressure. Will he step up in Boston and carry us to the Post Season?

P.S. I think slipping into the WC via Chicago is a real chance. While the Red Sox and Indians are playing to win, the White Sox are playing NOT to lose. They have the toughest schedule, with 6 against the Indians. Lets just hope one of them takes 5 of 6.

With all this talk about the final three games and mathematical poissibilities, it prompted me to look at the upcoming schedules and I noticed something that no one has mentioned yet: THERE IS NO CHANCE FOR A ONE GAME PLAYOFF BETWEEN THE RED SOX AND YANKS AFTER THE LAST DAY OF THIS SEASON!!!

In the next 15 days, the Red Sox have 14 games scheduled to be played.

In the next 15 days, the Yanks have 15 games scheduled to be played.

How is that? Because an earlier Red Sox-White Sox was posptponed with a makeup game not scheduled. And the one date that the Red Sox are off in the next 2 weeks, Chicago has a game.

Therefore, it is very possible that the season could end with either the Yanks or Sox up by only .5 game in the standing and, depending on the team in first place, the Red Sox would have to make up that game against Chicago on the day after the season ends.

Given the fact that the White Sox and Indians could be coming down to the wire on the final weekend of this season, this poses VERY interesting scanrios for all teams involved.