In an effort to shake the team up, the Yanks are making some position changes: Robinson Cano is being called up from Columbus to play second base; Tony Womack will move to left field; Godziller Matsui shifts from left to center, and Bernie Williams moves from center to the bench/DH. As a result, Steve Karsay has been designated for assignment, and is likely to be picked up off of waivers. In addition, Randy Johnson will miss at least one start with a tender groin, and could be sent to the DL. Andy Phillips will likely be shipped down to Columbus today to make room for Double A starter, Sean Henn.///

WOW !!!!! My gut reaction is WOW again, but then it's HELL YEAH, about time we did something, especially putting Bernie on the bench (it's amazing how fast and far he fell from superstar status.) Cano's promotion I like...not sure about Tony in left (how is his arm?. Matsui did a fine job in CF last year, no problem there. Karstay, hate to see him go, but it seems like he is never going to recover from that surgery. Phillips, after his 5, count-em FIVE STRIKEOUTS last night, maybe a return to the farm will get him re-focused. I only hope Henn is a cool as Wang - the Yankee youth movement has officially started and I say, IT'S ABOUT TIME!

Having Womack in left field is similar to moving Knoblauch there, even if the reasons are slightly different. There is at best a marginal gain in overall defensive ability (and I'm not convinced about this yet), while the offensive loss from putting Womack in the outfield might be more than enough to offset the defensive gain, especially on a team that has been offensively inconsistent this season. It's also a lot of pressure to put on young Cano at this point, who I'm pretty sure that he's no prospect (I'll rely on others to cite the stats to support this proposition). And I have no idea how they'll resolve the Tino-Bernie-Jason Bermuda Triangle yet.

Steve Karsay? No loss there. It would be nice to see the over-used and overrated Paul Quantrill take a hike, however. Anybody else will do, preferrably a position player, and enough of the ridiculous flirtation with the 11- or 12-man pitching staff. The Yankees need to get hitters into the lineup whenever they can.

I'm disappointed to see that this team is basically organized around the principle "If everybody has a good year, we'll win." Building a winner requires more planning than that. The Yankees should understand this better than anybody else.

Wow, it seems that a lot of people are ready to throw Bernie over the side. This is a guy who's spent his whole career as a Yankee, helped lead them to 7 straight division titles, 6 AL crowns and 4 World Series championships. I think he's earned the right to end this season as a Yankee. Yes, reduce his playing time (but can't you promote his replacement from the minors? Oh, right.) but I don't want to see him exiled, even at the risk of missing the playoffs.
After last night I suspect Andy's going to get demoted. Gee, the last time a Yankee struck out 5 times was in 1991, by a young player named Bernie Williams. I think he went on to a decent career.

And the Big Unit has a stiff groin, and so is unable to perform. See what happens when you clean up Times Square, Rudy?

rbj - Bernie was 22 in 1991. Phillips is 28.

If you saw Bernie's pathetic throw home on a short fly ball that let Eric Hinske score on Sunday, you'd be ready to throw him over the side too.

But the Womack shift is ridiculous. Enrique Wilson anyone? Hopefully the trade that will eventually come will be for someone better than Raul Mondesi. Cameron anyone?

Cameron makes a lot of sense.

Yes, my only hope is that last night's moves are a precursor to getting Cameron within the next few weeks. It might also explain why Torre ran Gordon out there once again.

I have heard a lot of talk about Cameron for Gordon on the internet. Buster Olney commented on it yesterday. I am very uncomfortable with Womack in LF. It seems like having Bernie in LF would make a lot more sense until they get someone better, unless his arm is bothering him that much. I guess this tells you what they think of Crosby. I have a bad feeling about what they are going to do. Can't be worse than having a poor hitting/decent fielding 2b playing a corner OF position, or can it?

I am very excited about seeing Cano. I wonder if Bernie has anything left. Even Womack is outplaying him this year.

The way I view it: Cano upgrades 2nd and Matsui, center. Left field is a mess, but Roy White can work with Womack until Cashman can trade one of the relievers for a competent out fielder who can play left or center. I'm sorry it has to come to this with Bernie, but he just couldn't continue playing center.

RJ's injury isn't good, but at least he didn't wait until he was immoblized to tell Mel.

Texas' bullpen has been pretty bad this year- any chance of prying one of the Rangers' 5 OF from them for an arm?

Not Hidalgo.

Not Dellucci despite his hot start.

Mench's head could only fit in Pat Pussy Toad or Gallego's old hat.

That leaves Matthews or Nix- any shot in hell?

I don't know about Cameron. The guy reeks of Mondesi: Guy with power, but awful plate discipline. Defense would definately be an upgrade, but he also has an ego problem.

The Womack-Knoblauch in LF analogy is perfect. What a waste of a "power" position. As usual, I can hear the Baseball Prospectus/Baseball Primer folks snickering already at the desperation of this move.

Anyone else concerned that our new outfielder once had Tommy John surgery on his throwing elbow?

Are you really sure that Cano is an upgrade over anything defensively, and even if he is, will his bat justify it? If he can't hit .220--and there's a chance he can't--then it's no upgrade because playing him makes the team materially weaker at three positions (2b, cf and lf). If Cano cannot, but the Yankees are married to this course of action, then Torre has to be prepared to hit for Cano in the late innings and play somebody else at 2b, which means that a bench player either has to be able to play 2b, or, somebody has to head to lf when Womack shifts back to 2b. Who is that? It can't be Williams if he's stuck with a lame throwing arm, it wouldn't be Giambi, so that leaves Crosby, who's not a star either. The only Yankees who can play 2b are Phillips (a known unknown) and Womack (a known known, unfortunately).

It all brings us back to a fundamental question that the sabermetric wing will start discussing sooner or later, so let me be the first to raise it here (Cliff, I suspect this is already on your mind): what would the team gain by moving Rodriguez to short, sending Jeter to CF or LF, and looking for somebody to play third? That could be a genuine defensive upgrade at two positions.

I don't think this move bodes well. It just shows how poorly we did in the off-season. I love Bernie Williams, but did anybody not see this coming? I hope Cano does well. I hope Johnson heals, but I can't help but wonder if the worse-case scenario for a 40-plus year old pitcher has reared it's ugly head. Is Henn any good?

Can you say desperation? In a nutshell, these are the types of moves you make in the off-season, not during the season.

The Yankees have way too much money tied up in their DH slot. They have several bad contracts among the starting rotation (Mussina, Brown, Wright, and Pavano). At > 34 1/2, the average age of the team is two years more than the Giants, the second-oldest team and the one which got the most flak during the winter.

The minor league organization is subpar and there are but a few players down there who can help at the big league level this year.

Womack isn't a serviceable 2B so how can they justify making a LF out of him? There must be two dozen fourth and fifth OF around the majors who are better than him. Is Womack even better than Williams? I find it mysterious as to why Bernie is going from starting CF to DH/Bench. Shouldn't there have been an interim position (such as LF) in there along the way?

I also think Posada may be showing the wear and tear of catching 130+ games for five consecutive seasons. Maybe they can bring up Navarro later this year...oh, that's right, they traded him!

The sad thing is that there are no solutions, short of taking the payroll up from $200M to $225M or beyond. If they were willing to do that, they should have signed Beltran.

Can you say, "It's another fine mess you've gotten us into, George?"

"Having Womack in left field is similar to moving Knoblauch there, even if the reasons are slightly different. There is at best a marginal gain in overall defensive ability (and I'm not convinced about this yet), while the offensive loss from putting Womack in the outfield might be more than enough to offset the defensive gain, especially on a team that has been offensively inconsistent this season."

This would only be true in a vacuum, but the Yankees are committed (now anyway) to playing and batting Womack nomatter what. So you have to abandon the hitting value/position calculation, and consider only the overall offensive value of the lineup. Here's what I mean: the current batters in the lineup:

Jeter, Bernie, Sheff, Matsui, A-Rod, Posada (Flaherty), Giambi/Sierra*, Matinez, Womack

The proposed lineup:
Jeter, Womack, Sheff, Matsui, A-Rod, Posada (Flaherty), Giambi/Bernie/Sierra*, Martinez, Cano

It does not matter if Womack is by far the worst hitting LF in the league--it only matters whether Womack+Cano+Giambi/Sierra/Bernie produces more offense than Womack+Bernie+Giambi/Sierra (which essentially boils down to Cano v. Bernie). It also matters if the proposed changes compromise the defense enough to offset any potential offensive gain--that is a legitimate concern.

In any case, hopefully this is only a stop gap until the team can find ANY credible outfielde. If a RF/LF, then Matsui stays in CF; if a CF, then Matsui shifts back to LF. In either case, Womack and Cano duke it out at 2B, or one of them is traded.

Everyone also has to remember that this isn't a move made to fix a long term problem (we don't do that) but rather to "shake up" the team and send a message. Things were not getting done as is, and the team looked lifeless. This will change things, but I imagine that within two weeks or so, we will either see the old lineup once again, or the old lineup plus a new outfielder/dh. Of course, we have so many DH's now its rediculous. Once Sierra comes of the DL, we will have Bernie/Sierra/Giambi competing for one position. Sierra could, in theory, play the outfield, but lets hope that isn't the case. Martinez will play every day at first, and Sierra and Bernie will play a lot. So where does this leave Giambi?

What a fiasco.

I can't believe how the tables have turned: all of a sudden the Yanks are the sideshow to the Mets' main attraction.

The Mets used to be the rotisserie team that we all chuckled out, with a penchant for signing all the big names thus ending their careers. Vaughan, Alomar, Burnitz...

Why didn't we hold on to our guys? Why?

We could have held on to Tino and made an organic transition to Johnson, a la Girardi to Posada.

We could have held on to Juan Rivera and phased him in to relieve Bernie.

And who was a better bench man than Cairo? He was quality goods.

It shouldn't have had to come to this, flailing about thirty games into the season like rank amateurs.

P-L-A-N spells plan. As in, let's adopt one. For the long-term. And for the love of all things holy, we need to give it time to breathe.

It was funny to me to watch the Mets wallow in expensive mediocrity occasioned by sad-sack management. I'm not laughing now.

I think this puts the lie to the notion of Jeter as team leader. If Jeter were team leader, he'd volunteer for CF and open short to Pay-rod. Jeter certainly isn't stupid enough to believe that he's a better shortstop than E-Rod.

This move would be the biggest simple upgrade for this team, given it's lack of tradeable commodities and serviceable players on the farm.

Any talk of prying an outfielder such as Kearns or Willy Mo Pena from the Reds. Graves is godawful, and is blowing saves left and right. I'd love to get Kearns here for his youth and tremendous upside. Probably, the Boss would want Griffey anyway.

Man, reading the Banter every day is making my stomach turn. Everyone's so down on this team; it's as if other good teams (such as every A's team of the late 90's and early 2000's) didn't start off slowly in the past. I guess this start has been the worst case scenario but, people, let's, I don't know, stop being so negative.

>This would only be true in a vacuum, but >the Yankees are committed (now anyway) to >playing and batting Womack nomatter what. >So you have to abandon the hitting >value/position calculation, and consider >only the overall offensive value of the >lineup.

You're looking only at the offensive side of the equation. They are already weak offensively at second base due to Womack's presence in the lineup. And absolutely, as they have presented the question, the issue for them is whether Cano can match Williams's offensive production. The problem is, that even if he does, New York has to to hope that Cano can play second better than Womack (not necessarily), that Womack can play a passable left (he's probably even worse than Bernie), and that Matsui can cover center adequately (maybe, but it's not his regular position, and he's not Andy Van Slyke). What I'm saying is: they are framing the question incorrectly. To ignore the defensive value component of the equation while focusing solely on the Bernie vs. Cano on offense is potentially a costly mistake, driven by panic rather than analysis.

Of course, some of the logjam could be relieved by getting rid of Rey Sanchez. Then, if they acquire another OF, Womack/Cano can battle for the 2B/backup IF position (Womack did play 3B for the D-backs). If they keep 13 non-pitchers, then Phillips inevitably gets sent back to the minors.

But if they actually go to 14 non-pitchers (as Cashman says he wants), Phillips can be kept around as back-up 1B/2B/3B/platoon DH.

Of course, this would require the Yanks to think outside of the box of having individual players dedicated to specific positions. Rather, they would have to think of clusters of positions and players:

2B/3B/SS: Cano, Womack, Phillips, Jeter, and A-Rod
1B/DH: Martinez, Phillips, Giambi, Sierra, Bernie, [Posada]
OF: [new OF], Matsui, Sheff, Bernie, Crosby, [Sierra], [Womack]
C: Posada, Flaherty
Fast Guy of bench: Crosby, [new OF?], Womack

I'm surprised that no one has mentioned the fact that Womack used to play RF for the D'Backs. He's not going to be a butcher like Knoblauch was. He should be able to hold his own. He even had 8 assists that year in 122 games. Not bad.

Nick, why the negativity? I'll speak for myself. It's because it's hard to find people to actually cheer for even if they're playing poorly as a team. When Nick and Sori and Rivera and Cairo--and all the other small time bit players the Yanks have had over the years, your Spencers, Ledees...--I could pull for them as developing players. I felt I had something invested in their success. When they failed, the failure was easier to take because they were long-term projects. I kept imagining how cool it would be if any of these people became the next Jeter or Bernie or Mattingly. Continuity is the keynote, as is dynamism. The win-it-all mentality makes for profoundly boring baseball when the team doesn't win it all.

All I'm saying is that if this team were struggling with some young and promising players thrown into the mix, I wouldn't be so negative. I'd be patient.

Womack's performance in outfield was reviewed favorably by BP at the time. Positivity!

Weeping, you're right. I'm just sad about the whole thing is all.

I know Nick, it ain't pretty.

I'm glad they're giving Cano a chance, but he may not be at the major league level. E.g., a couple of weeks ago many of us were complaining that Torre wasn't giving Andy Phillips a chance.

Questions: Does Bernie's sore elbow affect his hitting? How long will it take for his elbow to heal? Will it heal enough for him to play center adequately?

Do the Yankees want Placido Polanco, also a converted second baseman, to play left for them instead?

"I'm glad they're giving Cano a chance, but he may not be at the major league level. E.g., a couple of weeks ago many of us were complaining that Torre wasn't giving Andy Phillips a chance."

Yes, but how much of a chance has Phillips had so far? 25 ABs. I complained a couple of weeks ago they did not give him a shot, and I will complain again if they give him the boot after only 25 AB.

Tony Womack, LF??? Man, $200M just doesn't go very far does it. And Yankee fans only solution to this mess is to spend more. Shame. Why don't you do what you tell other teams to do and develop your own talent? It's been at least 8 years since the Yankees have brought up and kept a really productive player up from their farm system.

Boomer - the way to rings is by buying talent. Just ask the Red Sox. [wink]

wow! i thought calling womack the "by far the worst hitting LF in the league" was an exaggeration. i did the research to refute it. but it's absolutely friggin true.

on an equally depressing note: everyone should go here and read the portion of buster olney's new book that have up on espn.com. it's sad, but a great read.

sorry... link:

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/
columns/story?columnist=olney_buster&id=2051491

a few things:
Phillips is a decent hitter and would be a quality platoon 1B/PH/etc. He can even play 2B in a pinch.

Cano has hit well enough in AAA. He should be OK (especially against righties). Bill James (back when he wasn't a crank) showed that how a player does in AAA, when adjusted for league, park, age, etc. was as good an indicator of performance as prior big league numbers.

I think the biggest question marks are LF and the BP. By simply releasing Karsay they're saying that Quantrill, Gordon, Sturtze, Frod, and the LOOGY duo are capable of being the bridge to Mo. I'm not so sure.
Quantrill has horrible K/9 numbers and has been lousy since last year's all-star game.
Gordon's overuse has been well documented at every Yankee blog on the internet. He may or may not be effective in 2005.
Sturtze has a lot in common with Witasik. He had a 5+ ERA last year, has one this year, and has one for his career.
Stanton had a good second half last year. But that doesn't change his (or Groom's) age and his reduced effectiveness the past few years.

I think comparing Cano's numbers to Bernie's makes sense on one level, but I think comparing Womack's to a replacement level LF's numbers is at least as informative. A lot of Yankee fans thought he didn't hit well enough for a 2B. He certainly doesn't hit well enough for a 2B.

I applaud promoting Cano. I think moving Womack to LF is absurd. I'd rather put him on the bench and leave the OF as it is until a decent OF is on the roster.

Just read today's "Around The Majors" report, and it had this nugget:

"Womack ranks 12th in the past half century in worst OPS vs. the league average (min: 5000 PA)--"

Hidden a few lines up from Womack, though, is Rey "Dirty" Sanchez.

Yes, the Yankees, with a $200 million payroll, have 2 of the worst players in the past 50 years in terms of OPS vs. league average.

Grr.

The Yanks aren't alone in failing to develop talent (ask the Giants and the Red Sox). The majority of prospects they've dealt fizzled, which is actually again a credit to the Yankee front office, which has recognized the difference between contenders and pretenders better than most organizations. The issue here is that many of us doubt whether Cano has any value as a prospect. Color me unimpressed.

Also, it's not Jeter's job to tell the team how to solve roster allocation problems and to volunteer for new duties. Maybe he already did make the suggestion, and the Yankees said no? Jeter isn't big on self-aggrandizement through the press. It's one of the reasons we like him, isn't it?

stop it. you're making me nauseated.

Re: #37 - Clay, FYI:
http://www.netshrine.com/vbulletin2/showthread.php?t=16645

it's not pretty

not you, murray. just the people who are talking about Womack in left.

"...and Yankee fans only solution to this mess is to spend more."

No way, kcboomer! We've got way better ideas. I think the Yankees should trade Giambi to the Mets for Carlos Beltran. That's the perfect solution. Get it done Cashman!

What? I, as a Yankee fan, have no control over what the Yankees do? Huh. Well I guess that means I've been following the Yankees all these years just for fun!

The moves by Cashman are two-fold: to shake up a lethargic, unmotivated team (thanks to Joe Torre and his unwillingness to ever light a fire under anybody, big contracts or no big contracts) and to position the team for trades, both in the short run and in terms of the organization's longterm future. If Cano pans out, you can hand him the job or trade him. Gordon is undoubtedly being rehabilitated for a trade...perhaps to the Mets for Cameron. Perhaps to the Giants for Alfonzo. And, as an additional benefit, we get to see some youth on the team, whether they're packaged or, hopefully, stick. The sub-text of this is that Joe Torre stops being an impediment to the development of Yankee farmhands. At the very least they can provide energy and speed off the bench and in the bullpen. At best, they can become solid major leaguers (even if they eventually get traded for upgrades). In a worst case scenario, since Joe Torre is untouchable until the end of the season at the earliest, we can at least see some minor league talent given a shot so we can make some rebuilding deals by the July deadline. If we can make 2005 a seedbed for 2006 and beyond, I'd take that as a Yankees fan. Of course, I'm still hoping we can turn it around this season. Fingers tightly crossed.

Jeremy asked for stats on Sean Henn...apparently he has beeen lights out at AA Newark (a perfect fit against the D-Rays), Totals 2 -1 record 0.71 era; 25.1 innpitch; 16 hits; 2 er; 9 bb; 21K's. He is 6-4, 215 pounds and has a 94 mph heater, and a wicked change. He has just come into his own, hopefully he is the real deal!

JohnnyC, interesting take. I worry that you have too generous view of Cashman though. What in recent memory has Cashman done to inspire confidence?

I also wonder if the Yanks are so ready to send Gordon away considering the multitude of relief problems. I'm not saying they shouldn't trade him for a CF, I'm just doubting that Cashman is planning to trade him. Anyway, a general question: If they do trade Gordon, who would you want back? I'd like Kearns or Willy Mo. Cameron would be a good match. Not too high on Alfonzo though.

The question I have is, if the Yankees are doing this to position themselves for a trade who do they trade? They have relievers but they are getting almost to the point of being useless. Gordon is about the only one with value and he's questionable because of injuries. The farm system is nearly bare and really do they want to trade even more of their prospects? This move could be to showcase Cano so he can be traded to the Mets or Reds.

Bob Klapisch had this anecdote about Gordon's and Quantrill's trade value:

"But when one National League GM was asked Monday about his interest in Gordon and/or Quantrill, the executive almost laughed out loud.

"No thanks," is what he said."

(link: http://www.bergen.com/page.php?qstr=eXJpcnk3ZjczN2Y3dnFlZUVFeXkxMTMmZmdiZWw3Zjd2cWVlRUV5eTY2ODg3MTcmeXJpcnk3ZjcxN2Y3dnFlZUVFeXk2)

NL GM, hmmm...if that was Omar Minaya then you can forget about Cameron.

In the offseason, Gordon was one of the players teams were demanding from the Yanks, has his value really fallen that far? I doubt it, jsut because he is off to a slow start, he still has value, especially to a team like the Mets who really really need a bullpen.

I think womack will eventually find that he isn't playing very much...

Does anyone else get annoyed by Buster Olney and find that he really doesn't know what he is talking about? (don't get me wrong, I fully believe in the problems of the Yankees steeming from George taking over and trading and trading and trading, but Olney is staking his reputation by bashing the Yankees since 2001)

Getting Cameron would be an improvement and make the team better, but not enough to make us post season worthy. Jetes, Matsui, ARod and Sheff are not enough. Tino, Posada and Giambi must ALL improve greatly, and 1 of the 3 needs to be dangerous again (Giambi?).

The Red Sox have some short term problems and their record reflects it.... the only reason there is a glimmer of hope of a post-season if the Yanks can turn it around.

But in the by-and-large, I feel we won't make the post-season. I hate to say it, but if the Yankees believe it, then maybe the trades/buys they make will be more long-term oriented, and not stop-gap measures. Who ever they get, I hope it is someone who will help us in 2006 and 2007. I'm tired of 1 yr players.

Lets hope that Griffey has a GREAT year. If so, a Cincy outfielder may be available. A guy like Kearns is better for the future then a Cameron. I'm not ready to give up on this year yet, but this teams needs surgery.... not a band aid!!!!!

I laugh when reporters quote anonymous scouts, general managers, bat boys, hot dog vendors...does it ever occur to them that anyone talking to them has an agenda? Whether it's pro or anti-Yankee, no one speaks to Bob Klapisch or Buster Olney(as an example, not to demean them specifically)off the cuff as a disinterested friend who just happens to work in baseball with utter honesty. Those people, if they exist, get fired pretty quickly. I recall Bud Mishkin getting a snow job on the air from one of the Rangers' veteran scouts a couple of seasons ago. The scout poo-poohed the Yankees farm system but was lavish in his praise of, of all people, Alex Graman. In fact, he opined to Bud and his audience of New Yorkers, the Rangers wouldn't mind acquiring him in a trade if the Yankees couldn't find any use for him. Was he unaware that he was on TV? Was John Hart unaware that the scout was on TV in New York?

Forget CF for the moment - our BP is in DEEP trouble. Trading Flasher for Cameron would effectively be the death knell for the 2005 season.

Man, it sure is a fine line between prospective WS champions and league also-rans.