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Let's Talk, Turkey (or, Let's Make a Dope Deal)
2007-11-14 13:56
by Alex Belth

Over at ESPN, Buster Olney confirms the Daily News report from earlier today that Alex Rodriguez is in fact talking directly to the Yankees, sans Scott Boras, about staying in New York. Here's the story.

Comments (136)
Show/Hide Comments 1-50
2007-11-14 14:07:34
1.   tommyl
Hi Alex, how about 7 years at $13 million? That's what we pay all of our position players. What's that, you think you are better than Posada? Well, let's just ask him...
2007-11-14 14:11:59
2.   E-Rocker
Can Peter Gammons ever let someone other than the Red Sox get credit for anything? Here is the beginning paragraph of his article regarding the Cy Young: While C. C. Sabathia earned the Cy Young, Josh Beckett earned his place alongside Johan Santana as the best pitcher in baseball.

One of the reasons Beckett was good and reliable and fresh in October -- taking the role of a No. 1 starter, carrying his team through three straight series and winning a world championship for the second time in five years -- is because he didn't have to do what Sabathia did in the regular season. And the award is based solely on the regular season.

Sabathia threw 40 more innings, faced 143 more batters and threw 478 more pitches than Beckett. He picked up the slack with Jake Westbrook disabled, and Cliff Lee and Jeremy Sowers back in Buffalo, and deserves top 10 MVP votes for getting the Indians to a tie with the Red Sox for best record in baseball. But all those innings, batters and pitches showed in October. Velocity is never an indicator of wear or injury -- command is. And the man with the 5.24 to 1 strikeout to walk ratio was clearly gassed trying to deal with the hitting approach of Boston's hitters.

His bias is really becoming way too apparent in his writing.

2007-11-14 14:16:53
3.   Mattpat11
Peter Gammons has become little more than a Red Sox PR man.
2007-11-14 14:18:51
4.   Mattpat11
I wonder if a provision in the A-Rod contract can be that he can't behave like a moron. Like a morals clause.
2007-11-14 14:26:29
5.   Simone
I am reposting from below:

Don't stop believin, Hold on to the feelin', Streetlight people:

"He reached out to us through a third party," Steinbrenner said in a telephone interview. "He has expressed a desire to stay a Yankee. He's even willing to make certain sacrifices to do so."

http://tinyurl.com/32zuzz

2007-11-14 14:27:41
6.   Eric
Now, let us all gather 'round a pray our new third basemen is not mentioned in any godforsaken "Mitchell Report"
2007-11-14 14:30:49
7.   standuptriple
6 You mean the "Mitchell Report" being compiled by a Sox faithful? If it's anything like I expect from Big Gov't it will be a letdown. I hope our tax $ are enjoying the spotlight though.
2007-11-14 14:35:47
8.   standuptriple
4 Where does the infamous "Ha!" fall under that clause?
2007-11-14 14:37:53
9.   yankster
4 A moron clause would be worth millions annually to the Yankees. I'd love to see them throw in a moron event clause - three or more moron events in a season kill the no-trade.
2007-11-14 14:39:22
10.   tommyl
We could pull an Arroyo on him. Take a hometown discount and then ship him off for a ton of prospects ;)
2007-11-14 14:39:22
11.   51cq24
8 maybe it should just be off-field conduct.
2007-11-14 14:40:38
12.   rbj
I've got no problem with a certain player returning, but I'm not holding my breath. It takes care of the thirdbase issue and right handed power issue. Betemit is fine coming off the bench.

Now we just need for Mo to accept the 3 year/$5 mil (it's a damn fine offer Mo) and have Andy come back.

2007-11-14 14:42:05
13.   standuptriple
12 And not sleepwalk in April.
2007-11-14 14:45:35
14.   Jersey
Y'all saw that ARod is openly admitting the meeting himself, on his own Web site, right?
2007-11-14 14:46:01
15.   Mattpat11
9 It would be something where every time he says or does something off the field that is clearly designed to start a media circus, he gets fined.

Obviously this never could happen, but it would make things so much easier.

2007-11-14 14:50:49
16.   Shaun P
15 The fish rags would hate such a clause.

I wonder if it would really work though.

10 "Hey Ned, we know you guys were sad that you didn't sign A-Rod. So, how about we give you A-Rod, and in return, you give us four of Chad Billingsley, Clayton Kershaw, Andy LaRoche, James Loney, and Matt Kemp. You know, the deal the Marlins wanted for Cabrera.

I know A-Rod is older than Miguel, but he's in far better shape, he can actually play 3B - or even SS! - and he and Joe are likethis."

;)

2007-11-14 14:58:26
17.   standuptriple
10 , 16 I love the level of evil that this thread just took. Many thanks.
2007-11-14 14:59:13
18.   OldYanksFan
Jim Caple, Red Sox fan:
"You're joking, right? You can't be serious. Sixty-one percent of you who responded to our Page 2 poll on Tuesday wouldn't want baseball's best player on your favorite team? You'd be disappointed if your team signed a (soon-to-be) three-time MVP and Gold Glove winner who can play third base or shortstop? You don't want a player who could become the all-time home run king? If that's really true, I have another poll question for you:

You don't want the modern-day offensive equivalent of Babe Ruth on your team? Seriously? Do you feel this way because your drug problem is that severe, or because the American educational system is that bad? Or do you simply listen to too much sports talk radio?"

2007-11-14 15:00:09
19.   OldYanksFan
More from Caple:
Look, I'm no A-Rod apologist. He's a diva, and a bigger phony than most team owners. But you know what? That doesn't matter. Did Lou Gehrig and Babe Ruth get along? Was Ted Williams considered a "winner"? Did every teammate like Reggie Jackson? Does Manny Ramirez even know what team he plays for?

HA!

2007-11-14 15:04:44
20.   OldYanksFan
Must read: http://tinyurl.com/yw4ue8... That sound you hear...
2007-11-14 15:08:20
21.   Mattpat11
I agree with him. Alex Rodriguez is a jackass. I don't like the guy. I think he thinks of no one but himself.

But I still want that level of talent on his team.

2007-11-14 15:09:26
22.   weeping for brunnhilde
All this emotional roller-coastering is bad for my system.

Someone wake me when Alex has a signed, sealed and delivered contract.

I dare not start to hope again...

2007-11-14 15:14:33
23.   standuptriple
22 I agree with that mindset. Diss me once, shame on you.
2007-11-14 15:16:05
24.   Shaun P
21 Yep. Its the same reason why we'd all be thrilled for the Yanks to land Miggy Cabrera - weight, work ethic, and partying issues. (Besides - there is no one more qualified to teach a young man how to party hard and remain a great ballplayer than Mr. Derek Jeter.)

Or if the Yanks had gotten pre-decline phase Manny. The dude hits, and that helps the team win. The rest is irrelevant.

This is why signing Bonds to DH 110 games and play LF 25 games (and pinch hit the rest of the time!) would be a fantastic thing, whatever you think of the man as a human being.

2007-11-14 15:16:39
25.   mehmattski
Wow. I step away from the computer and this thing goes from wild speculation to, depending on the source, somewhere between plausible and done. A-Rod posting on his site. Mark Feinsand saying it's a done deal. Incredible.

In the first place, I'm one of those fans who cheers for the front of the jersey, not the back, so I don't really care about the personal character of the person inhabiting the jersey. But I realize that there are many fans who don't feel like me and don't want a (for example) a Sheffield, a Bonds, or an A-Rod on their favorite team. So, for the sake of those who do care about such things, I say A-Rod's gotta fire Boras if he wants full forgiveness in the Bronx.

He won't get forgiveness from Peter Gammons, of course. To him, the timing of Boras' announcement was like Randy Moss' "mooning" at Lambeau was for Joe Buck...

2007-11-14 15:16:51
26.   Shaun P
24 Argh. "weight, work ethic, and partying issues aside."
2007-11-14 15:18:47
27.   Mattpat11
25 I think Yankee fans can forgive him. I don't think we're stupid enough to forget.
2007-11-14 15:19:36
28.   Knuckles
Caple's an M's fan, and a doofus.
2007-11-14 15:20:51
29.   cult of basebaal
25 i think "forgetiveness" only truly comes with an 800 pound gorilla of a post-season, preferably against the hated ones ...
2007-11-14 15:27:19
30.   cult of basebaal
wheeee! the crazy isn't over yet! and now the needle tips back towards the machiavellian machinations of sith lord boras ...

Michael Weiner, general counsel for the Players Association, told Newsday's Ken Davidoff, "the union has been assured that the Yankees will respect Alex's decision to designate Scott Boras as his representative."

2007-11-14 15:33:57
31.   ms october
22 et al I agree. If he's back, great he obviously fits a huge need - if not, we move on again.

One other thing about this whole drama though - no matter what happens, the Yanks, should not completely alienate Boras no matter what some people think of him, as not only does he have other clients that the Yanks may need/want (perhaps a Texeria), but he is scooping up so many draftees, that the Yanks don't need him f'ing up our drafts the next few years as it is so clear that it is imperative to develop and keep good young players.

2007-11-14 15:34:04
32.   Shaun P
30 But that doesn't mean that A-Rod can't hear the offers himself and then tell Boras, "Scott, make this happen, and the money they're offering is fine." Or just listen to general stuff and then tell Boras, "I want to be intimately involved in the negotiations, and I will tell you what to agree to and what is unacceptable."

The agent works for the player, even if there are some agents and players who forget this.

2007-11-14 15:34:18
33.   OldYanksFan
http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2007/11/alex_rodriguez_could_return_to.html

Alex Rodriguez is closing in on a $280 million deal to remain with the Yankees, just weeks after his relationship with the team seemed to be severed.

"Alex has reached out to us through a third party," Steinbrenner said today. "It kind of looks like he wants to stay."

Steinbrenner hinted that Rodriguez might make concessions on his salary to make up for the lost Rangers subsidy.

"It looks like he's willing to make certain sacrifices to stay a Yankee," Steinbrenner said.

#27 anybody?

2007-11-14 15:35:18
34.   monkeypants
This A-Rod development is curious indeed. What do we all think the deal really is:

A. Lowell on the market lowered A-Rod's leverage vis-a-vis the Yanks, forcing A-Rod back to the Yanks.

B. A-Rod/Boras totally misplayed their hand, opted out, and found no suitors, forcing A-Rod back to the Yanks.

C. This is all a ploy to lure the Yanks into talks, which A-Rod/Boras hope will spark the bidding war they expected.

D. None of the above.

2007-11-14 15:35:18
35.   standuptriple
30 I think that's somewhat misleading as well. Boras is still his rep, the Yanks just don't want him in the room. Sounds like lawyer Bob Loblaw to me.
2007-11-14 15:38:31
36.   ms october
35 Yeah, it doesn't seem Boras is fired or anything. The Yanks probably wanted to hear from Arod's mouth what was up before proceeding.
2007-11-14 15:41:34
37.   RIYank
36 Right. I think the "no Boras!" part was probably hyped up a little by the press.

I'm not worried about alienating Boras, anyway. Boras will always do what he thinks will make the most money for his guys -- spiting the Yankees for screwing with him just isn't in his m.o.

2007-11-14 15:41:39
38.   OldYanksFan
34 (B) NO ONE except the Yankes will go 10 years. No One is going over $250m except the Yanks. MCab on the market didn't hurt either.
2007-11-14 15:41:45
39.   cult of basebaal
34

I think the likelihood A and B are limited by the fact that so little time has passed that the true market for a-rod has not really developed yet

which of course makes C all the more likely, but there is actually a non-zero chance that the following is true

D. a-rod actually wants to retire a yankee

2007-11-14 15:47:45
40.   Shaun P
34 Its either B (they screwed up) or C (using the Yanks to start a bidding war).

I hope its B. I fear its C.

But if it is a bidding war fake, the Yanks will know soon. They will want a deal done fast to make sure its not that. If Boras and A-Rod stall, that's a bad sign.

Of course, if there's an article in the LA Times in the next two days that says "Angels prepared to offer A-Rod 10 years, $300M" we (and the Yanks) will also know it was just a ploy.

2007-11-14 15:48:03
41.   standuptriple
Or he cares too much about his image and still needs Yankee $.
2007-11-14 15:49:54
42.   mehmattski
0 From the article Alex linked us:
"Many possible suitors, from the Tigers to the Marlins to the Giants, have either stated flatly that they were not in the A-Rod Sweepstakes, or that it is highly unlikely that they would be."

Um... why do supposedly self-respecting journalists continue to report that the Florida Marlins are a "possible suitor" for Alex Rodriguez? Is it the fact that the Marlins are actively shopping the only two players on their roster that make more than $2M per season? Or perhaps it's because signing A-Rod would increase the Marlins' payroll by 150 percent? This keeps bothering me, and it seems only because Larry Beinfest, when asked after the World Series about A-Rod, said, with a smirk, "we're not ruling it out."

It makes me think most of journalism is just a bunch of groupthink.

You know what I heard? A source close to the Kansas City Royals, speaking under anonymity, confirmed that the Royals "had not ruled out" signing Barry Bonds. Now go report that everywhere, sheep!

2007-11-14 15:50:50
43.   ChrisS
34

A) ... for a raise, which is a bargain compared with the $35mill/year for ten years that no one offered.

B) ... for a raise, which is a bargain compared with the $35mill/year for ten years that no one offered.

C) ... because no one offered anything remotely close to what they wanted.

Unfortunately, I think the Yankees are getting played here unless they get A-Rod for less than $25 million / season

2007-11-14 15:52:18
44.   ms october
40 Yeah, I think we will know fairly soon which one.

Whoever was worried about this being a boring off-season shouldn't have fretted - we are almost to Thanksgiving.

Sorry if this was posted and I missed it - it is a little late, but for OYF and the other big Bonds' backers - the Yanks may have some competition.
http://tinyurl.com/2ytp4s

2007-11-14 15:57:03
45.   monkeypants
Pet Abe is reporting this as a done deal. And if so, 43 will not be happy.
2007-11-14 16:01:48
46.   Shaun P
43 45 Under the old deal, the Yanks were going to pay A-Rod $20M (in 2008), and $25M (in both 2009 and 2010 - or he could have opted out again), and then, under the extension, $30M from 2011 to at least 2015, maybe 2017 (total of $280M), if the Yanks did get him back for $275M, that sounds like a win to me.

Damn.

2007-11-14 16:02:06
47.   Simone
If this is a done deal, then I'm stunned that Alex came back to the Yankees. No one must have even sniffed close to the Yankees original offer. However, if Pete is right about the terms of the deal, Alex hasn't sacrificed anything and the Yankees are still out that $20 million that they were going to get from Texas. It is incredible that the Yankees would sign this guy for 10 years not go for 8 years which would have taken him to 40 years old. Oh well, not my money.
2007-11-14 16:02:24
48.   OldYanksFan
If ARod comes back, might this effect Andy's decision? Always nice to pitch on a winner.
2007-11-14 16:03:42
49.   ChrisS
45 Indeed, A-Rod once again got someone to outbid themselves. And somehow he's being reported as a nice guy that gave the Yankees a discount.
2007-11-14 16:04:08
50.   OldYanksFan
47 I guess ARod wants 800. Won't that be fun?
Show/Hide Comments 51-100
2007-11-14 16:04:41
51.   OldYanksFan
Time to talk BP help. Suggestions?
2007-11-14 16:07:00
52.   Shaun P
49 But how? See my 46 - and I just read in two different places (Daily News and ESPN.com) that the Yanks were likely to offer an extension that made A-Rod's total deal worth $289M.

$275M < $280M < $289M. Sure, when its numbers that big, its not a huge difference, but its still less. What am I missing here?

2007-11-14 16:08:13
53.   underdog
16 Stop making me cry, Shaun. It's bad enough to hear what the Marlins are asking - and hey, who can blame them, I guess...

But seriously, if the Dodgers don't end up with ARod, I do hope he ends up back in NY. I like the idea of him circumventing Borat, er, Borass, er Boras, too, though I don't completely trust it. Seems like a calculated PR move but maybe I'm just cynical.

2007-11-14 16:13:32
54.   Shaun P
53 My apologies, underdog - but that was a post that couldn't be passed up. =)

As a Yankees fan, I'd love to see the Yanks end up with the Dodgers' trove of prospects. (What fan of their team wouldn't?) But as a baseball fan, I think it'd be great if the Dodgers kept them all and played them all, and reaped the rewards. It would be a(nother) perfect lesson on how drafting and developing is far better than investing in free agents.

2007-11-14 16:16:56
55.   weeping for brunnhilde
30 ha ha haha ha!
2007-11-14 16:19:53
56.   monkeypants
48 My gut tells me that Pettitte's decision will not depend on A-Rod--or for pitching on a winner. He's already won a WS. At this point, it seems that purely personal factors are weighing more than on-field/career factors.

I am more interested in the Mo situation. If the Yanks were forced into rebuild/transition mode next season, then the Yankees might have been more willing to let him walk. But now, IF A-Rod is back, then suddenly Torregate is a distant memory. The big guns are back in place (A-Rod and Posada), and the team looks very much the competitor next season. In this context, Mo's 60 INN might make the difference between WC and WS (or at least that might be the perception). And if so, then does the team concede to his salary demands?

2007-11-14 16:25:45
57.   OldYanksFan
56 M&MM think the Cubs or someone else will offer Mo $50m. I can't see it. The guy is great, but also 38 and trending downhill. This contract is porential disaster for a team.

Question: Would another team offer Mo more then 3/$45
(and is Mo not getting a little greedy?)

2007-11-14 16:28:40
58.   monkeypants
57 I agree with you. But Mo could take less money because he was "insulted" by the Yankees. There is some PR pressure on them to over pay him even more than what they have already offered.
2007-11-14 16:30:13
59.   ny2ca2dc
57 etc, if Mo rejects that monster offer, you just go get Cordero and hardly notice the difference. The 45/3 is already absurd, though I'm happy it's been made because he's Mariano FREAKIN Rivera and I love him, but more than that and we're into the twilight zone.
2007-11-14 16:31:22
60.   Shaun P
57 Why would Mo, at 38, go to a new team, a new city, with people (and a manager) he doesn't know, over $5M? I just don't see it. That's not Mo.

And besides, I don't see any team offering Mo 3 years/$45M - or more.

56 Its not my money, so I say, why not pay Mo $50M/3 years? He made $1,431,125 total over 1996-1998; I think we can all agree he was vastly underpaid then. Why not overpay now?

2007-11-14 16:36:48